r/AdviceAnimals • u/ManChildMusician • 1d ago

Scratch a, ”Libertarian” find a contrarian

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835 Upvotes

91% Upvoted

85 comments sorted by

251

u/Chazhoosier 1d ago

Libertarianism is the infantile fantasy of individual rights without duty to the common good. Well, we're learning what rights without the common good amount to: the strong brutalizing the weak.

145

u/FiTZnMiCK 1d ago

Libertarians are like house cats: absolutely convinced of their fierce independence while utterly dependent on a system they don’t appreciate or understand.

14

u/black_anarchy 23h ago

This is the best explanation I've seen for it. Yep. I'm using this one too.

38

u/Spiel_Foss 22h ago

And like arrogant house cats, they are absolutely terrified if you toss them out into the real world.

Every US Libertarian I've ever met was a just a weed smoking Republican with a hidden fetish for fascism.

Their "freedom" is always at the expense of others and they often relish in that expense.

10

u/dertechie 20h ago edited 20h ago

I’ve known some who were just against any kind of concentrated power, closer to anarcho-capitalists.

Mind, that was over a decade ago and when I checked in on them more recently they were no longer so - they were closer to Republicans that like weed.

Even back then, it was an unsustainable philosophy that could not reach its ostensible goals of equality under the law with the tools it posited as solutions.

Any “libertarian“ for these tariffs is not a serious person and doesn’t understands their own philosophy at all. One of the core principles of the philosophy is “the market knows what it is doing better than you do”. Arbitrary tariffs should be anathema to them.

2

u/Niceromancer 17h ago

Concentrated power other than mega corps.

2

u/dertechie 16h ago

Nah, they weren’t a huge fan of those either. It was admittedly mostly that they hated regulatory capture and the tendency of regulation to favor larger conglomerates that could more efficiently handle that.

When I say they hated regulatory capture, I mean they saw regulatory capture the way Evangelicals claim to see Lucifer.

Now, a mega corporation in a regulatory structure that they were not bending to their own advantage and just crushing competition with economies of scale? They were totally cool with that, but that didn’t exist.

5

u/CarpoLarpo 23h ago

Wow.

Well said.

8

u/FiTZnMiCK 23h ago

TBF I stole it from some guy on Twitter.

I’d link it, but… you know, Twitter.

2

u/slapitlikitrubitdown 19h ago

I also ways just thought of them as conservatives minus the religiosity.

1

u/FiTZnMiCK 17h ago

Republicans that don’t want to be called Republicans.

1

u/MontiBurns 17h ago

Republicans with plausible deniability.

14

u/ptrexitus 1d ago

They are solo socialists. They want all the benefits and needs of a developed society, just don't want to pay for it.

1

u/octopornopus 5h ago

"I've been on food stamps, did anyone ever help me? NO!"

- I realize he wasn't Libertarian, but it sums it up

8

u/liquid_at 23h ago

Every time libertarianism has had power, they screwed up the economy. Then people were busy rebuilding, ended up forgetting about it and there they came again... the libertarians...

How could "let the strong abuse the weak" ever backfire? right?

1

u/Bunnymancer 12h ago

Red-tailed hawk screeches as a bald eagle flies above.

Aaaammmeeeriiiicccaaaa

1

u/random123121 1h ago

The "common good" is just an excuse to expand the government and control them with lobbying.

1

u/Chazhoosier 1h ago

^See? They're children screeching that duty is mean MOM AND DAD forcing them to do things like take out the TRASH!

1

u/random123121 45m ago

In my family we spent our days peeling potatoes while your mommy and daddy took you to mcdonalds, wasted half and littered the rest. But you did round up that extra 7 cents that will be used for "administrative fees"

-63

u/halfdeadmoon 1d ago

If you are going to disregard personal responsibility, you should use scare quotes like the meme

39

u/Mindless_Consumer 1d ago

It's my personal responsibility to brutalized the weak and then victem blame when they don't pull themselves up by their boot straps.

P.s. rent is due, oh it also increased 80%.

8

u/flexflair 1d ago

If you add in declaring bankruptcy once the taxes are due you might be qualified to lead America.

18

u/Pi6 1d ago

No, It is a personal responsibility to take part in community responsibility. It is a personal responsibility to support those suffering from a failure of community responsibilities. It is a personal responsibility to understand that not everyone shares your subjective definition of personal responsibility, and that many people are mentally or emotionally incapable of fulfilling your subjective idea of personal responsibility. Compassion and empathy are personal responsibilities.

8

u/Bagline 1d ago

There's this phenomenon whereby the best thing for an individual is NOT the best thing for the individual. Let me explain.

Take fishing as an example. The best thing for the individual is to catch as many fish as they possibly can. If everyone does this, the fish population drops and everybody is hurt, the price will go up which will increase the efforts to catch the now rare fish which will hurt the fish population even more. If we instead control and limit how many fish are caught not only do we catch more fish overall, but that fisher who was hurt before can have a more predictable income. Everybody benefits because we're stopping "personal responsibility" and enforcing a more common good focused rule set.

This applies to money/power as well. The best thing for the individual is to hoard as much as they can to make their life better. If everyone does this with no balancing forces, we end up where we are now with ridiculous wealth concentration at the top that will eventually unbalance and capsize the boat, and like it or not, we're all on the same f-ing boat.

0

u/halfdeadmoon 18h ago

Exploitation of a common good is not within the purview of exercising personal responsibility. 

1

u/Bagline 17h ago

On a personal scale it's not really exploitation or harmful which is why expecting people to police themselves will never work. They don't think they're doing anything wrong. Only in aggregate does it become a noticeable force.

and if they do know that in aggregate it is harmful (littering), people will also always justify their actions by pointing to someone else who is worse, or to minimize their own personal impact (it's just one bottle). It's the same as the "My vote doesn't count" mentality.

41

u/bookwing812 1d ago

This is the premise of the game BioShock : every libertarian loves free markets until it's their bottom line that gets affected.

2

u/bloodjunkiorgy 13h ago

Bioshock was a beautiful example of why libertarian capitalism is dogshit. Also, so was almost every single "future" based piece of media ever.

Not always libertarian, but always laden with often heavy handed anti-capitalist rhetoric.

46

u/Manakanda413 1d ago edited 21h ago

Nah libertarians hate tariffs - that’s the free market. Real libertarians also believe in essentially open immigration. What you’re seeing isn't Libertarians, it’s republicans who like legal weed and to not say they’re republicans so they can be "different"

32

u/r0botdevil 1d ago

Most of the people I've met who self-identify as libertarian are actually just conservatives who think it sounds cooler.

A good litmus test is to ask them what their stance is on things like gay marriage, recreational marijuana, and trans rights; if they don't support those things, then they aren't a libertarian.

9

u/ManChildMusician 1d ago

Hence the air quotes. I always press people to clarify what they mean, because actual libertarians will get excited to talk about it. It’s about the same as people who say they’re “moderate” as a dodge. Like, you really don’t have strong feelings one way or another, my dude?

8

u/Evolvin 1d ago

They're really Republicans who are smart enough to identify that they aren't in the elite, but callous enough to not give up on the dream.

-1

u/ballsackcancer 22h ago

Yeah, a lot of people on here not understanding what Libertarianism is. Most Libertarians are pro free trade, pro-choice, pro gun, and against the drug war. Most real Libertarians also hate the attacks on democracy perpetuated by Trump.

-8

u/Mercury756 1d ago

This right here. But you’re never going to find any kind of logic on Reddit outside of the deep blue left sea.

23

u/Makgraf 1d ago

I mean, Rand Paul voted to end Trump’s tariff on Canada. The libertarian Liberty Justice Center (the same guys who brought the case that gutted public service unions) are bringing a case to overturn the tariffs. Libertarian thinkers are against the tariff.

Now, there is a certain type of conservative man (and it’s always a man) who wants to fuck women and so will call himself a “libertarian” or an “independent” or “non-political” - but he’s actually just a standard maga guy.

18

u/rgnysp0333 1d ago

I was asked by an online troll "what's the role of tariffs in a free market?" I think he wanted me to say it's to promote domestic manufacturing, which is a goddamn pipe dream, but the answer is none. If you have tariffs, it isn't a free market.

3

u/Spiel_Foss 22h ago

The "free market" has always been a lie though.

Anyone who claims to support "free markets" has zero actual understanding of a capitalist economy.

The wealthy despise an uncontrolled market and know the only reason for capitalism is to steal the production of the working class.

4

u/Templar388z 22h ago

I’m not libertarian btw, but true libertarian are pissed off at the war mongering and taxes. They’re even trying to overturn the tariffs, they succeeded with the ones in Canada.

12

u/DreamingMerc 1d ago

They never were, my guy.

2

u/sneakysn00k 22h ago

“They was”

4

u/RipErRiley 1d ago

Libertarian? Cool I’m a Pisces

2

u/jimopl 1d ago

Bro...do you see any libertarian subs saying the tariffs are good? No, no one is in favor of these.

26

u/big_daddy68 1d ago

I think this is a shot of the “libertarians” that vote conservative because they are “fiscally conservative” even though the recent GOP presidents always runs up the deficit. These closet conservatives want to claim to be libertarian when in reality they are just GOP shills.

14

u/Critical-General-659 1d ago

The libertarian sub here on Reddit is filled with maga people larping as libertarians. Proud boys took over moderation a bit after J6. 

5

u/scott__p 1d ago

Yet they overwhelmingly voted for the guy who promised tariffs every time he spoke. It's nice to see them get exactly what they voted for

5

u/ManChildMusician 1d ago

The air quotes are intentional here. It’s short hand for that one kid who went to a semester of community college, decided Ron Paul was their whole identity, and then never bothered to study anything closer or do some soul searching. They proceeded to fail upward in their family’s business, and landed closet MAGA.

I’ve got next to no beef with actual Libertarians. It’s amusing when vapid pseudo-intellectuals try to avoid saying they’re MAGA by cosplaying as “libertarian.” Ladies, if a guy says they’re “libertarian” early on in a relationship, make sure they aren’t just avoiding a really big conversation to get laid.

7

u/SsooooOriginal 21h ago

I have not met a single "real" libertarian irl.

They have all fallen under the stereotypes listed here in the comments. Every. Single. One.

3

u/ken120 1d ago

And tariffs aren't government interference with said free market?

2

u/deyterkourjerbs 21h ago

During the early stages of the pandemic, I was really hopeful that seeing the need for a collaborative society would kill off libertarians or at least make them more ideologically nuanced. Wow, I couldn't have been more wrong.

2

u/thissomeotherplace 1d ago

Libertarians seek to further empower the rich in the deluded belief that a brighter future will follow

It was always an infantile fantasy destined to see a parasitic elite exploiting everyone else

And, thanks to their attacks on good governance, they've left no one to stop them

FAFO

8

u/maximumhippo 1d ago

Libertarians seek to further empower the rich in the deluded belief that a brighter future will follow they'll be one of the rich ones.

1

u/ballsackcancer 22h ago

What's wrong with free markets, stopping the drug war, giving women the right to choose, legalizing gay marriage/polygamy, trans rights, and curbing wasteful government spending?

3

u/joecool42069 23h ago

There's only 2 types of libertarians. Those who are ashamed to call themselves republicans, but always vote Republican and guys that want to fuck underage girls. Sometimes they're both.

-5

u/FF3 23h ago

This is funny but doesn't match my personal experience.

6

u/joecool42069 23h ago

Every "libertarian" i've spoken to, doesn't understand what their own proclaimed ideology even is. They claim to be libertarian, but want closed borders. They claim to be libertarian, but the moment things go to shit, they want government to fix it (e.g. A Libertarian Walks into a Bear). They don't want government telling THEM what to do, just others.

-2

u/FF3 23h ago

So you've only ever met confused people, but as you know what libertarianism is, you've clearly read people who did understand it.

I have met people who are libertarians and understand libertarianism.

4

u/joecool42069 23h ago

And my assessment is still the same. They have a juvenile understanding of how society functions and only want to do what they want to do.

You want to go live out in the woods and live your best Libertarian life... have at it. But, there are societal responsibilities we all have, when living in a community, whether you want them or not. Because society cannot function under a libertarian ideology.

1

u/FF3 23h ago

Agreed. I think that fake libertarians are simply realistic.

5

u/joecool42069 23h ago

But ashamed to associate themselves with the party they actually vote for. See, the first person in my original comment. :P

1

u/FF3 23h ago

OMG though they aren't pedophiles as a rule or even trend.

2

u/joecool42069 22h ago

I’m not going to say they all are. But you gotta admit, there’s a vocal number of them that think there shouldn’t be age limits.

1

u/FF3 23h ago

This is the bigger issue for me as they are the ones in power and tariffs are a risk.

But I'm also annoyed that there aren't any socialists at least remotely trying to defend the idea of tariffs if not the implementation. Plenty of people seem to have also forgotten that they are against globalization.

1

u/jdtrouble 22h ago

Last time i did a political compass questionnaire, it came back centrist libertarian. I get it, but i don't want to be associated with some of their nuttier policy ideas

1

u/henrysmyagent 12h ago

Scratch a "Libertarian" and watch an embarrassed Republican bleed.

1

u/CrazyYamDM 11h ago

Don't forget, drugs are bad until you need to release the silk road founder from jail...

1

u/PsychoTurtlenaut 5h ago

ITT: people who clearly don't understand what libertarian means.

1

u/glory_holelujah 2h ago

What's with the increase in confusion between 'was' vs 'were' I've been seeing lately?

1

u/random123121 52m ago

Libertarianism > Crony Capitalism Two Party System

1

u/Omegaman2010 21h ago

Ah yes, more people to blame. Adding Libertarians to my list of people to be mad at.

0

u/ballsackcancer 22h ago

Yeah, those weren't real "Libertarians". I don't know many true Libertarians that would support someone like Trump.

0

u/grammar_oligarch 21h ago

I’m in education, and I’ve pinpointed two types of teachers that help make more libertarians:

  1. The “cool” history teacher who doesn’t actually teach history and instead goes on vague political rants based on a superficial understanding of objectivism (which is already a simplified version of smarter philosophies). He coaches baseball and gets real upset if you point out that he works in education, a public service contradictory to libertarianism.

  2. The absolute bitch of an English teacher who treats every student like shit. Her husband makes $350,000 a year doing some type of hyper specific contracting work, which makes her feel like a successful person because she makes him dinner. Her class has more rules than lessons, and she makes every single educational opportunity a competition that crushes the spirit of all but the luckiest (and usually whitest) of students.

They are both utterly awful to interact with at work and create so much departmental drama that their emails are often signed “Produced by Dick Wolf.”

0

u/ManChildMusician 18h ago

That’s oddly specific and yet accurate. I’d add to 1: has slightly age inappropriate girlfriend, and shows up to grad parties.

-1

u/TheSaltyseal90 22h ago

I’m glad society is realizing how stupid libertarians are

-4

u/Critical-General-659 1d ago

Reddit libertarians. That sub got taken over by proud boys sympathizers from the r/goldandblack sub after J6. 

6

u/Which-Ad7072 1d ago

Literally every Libertarian I know in real life is like Reddit Libertarians. They're basically Conservatives with zero empathy. I can get Conservatives in real life to admit that things like universal health care or free school lunches are good, even desirable. I have never met a Libertarian in real life who ever agreed that taxation for those things is okay, let alone good. What matters is not paying taxes and making sure billionaires are free to do whatever they want without interference.

God, even Ayn Rand hated Libertarians. They can't even get the people they're pretending represent them to like them. 

-3

u/RedBeans-n-Ricely 20h ago

Libertarians are republicans who don’t want to admit it

-44

u/zzemerald 1d ago

Vote to make this subreddit PoliticalAdvice XD this is ridiculous

19

u/DonaldKey 1d ago

There is an unfollow button…

16

u/ryfitz47 1d ago

yeah! this sub should focus on the things that are affecting our daily lives not stupid poli- oh wait.

9

u/ComicMAN93 1d ago

Everything is political. Including the things you love. Get over it.

9

u/0masterdebater0 1d ago

Calling for a vote because the sub is too political.

I love concise irony like that.

🤣

-6

u/Majsharan 1d ago

Free markets didn’t exist before the tarriffs

4

u/FreakDC 1d ago

True but now they are even less free.