That scene from "The Hustler" (1960) in the train carriage, when Bert antagonizes Eddie over his broken hands and being a "cripple"?

[u/Legal-Dealer-3027]

So Bert gives it, "how's the hands?".

To which Eddie replies, "fine".

Then Bert gives it, "good....... I'd hate to think I was putting my money on a cripple".

This obviously sets off Eddie who responds heatedly.

Sara cuts in though, not wanting Eddie to lose his cool and pacifies the situation, making an excuse on Bert's behalf.

This scene is still a little lost on me.

Bert seems to be impressed with Sara's more insightful understanding of the game being played, how to manage it, and how not to fall for those underhanded traps.

The fact Eddie got caught in petty traps like this repeatedly throughout the film is almost a prominent theme, as he expresses his own dismay at being "suckered" by the thugs in Aurthors pool hall where they broke his hands.

Then we see his short tempered response to James Finely after he whoops him for twelve thousand........ "you must....... come again".

Instead of indulging that and playing along, he cuts him short and walks out.

.......

But specifically on the scene of Eddie, Bert and Sara sat together in the train carriage and Bert makes the "cripple" remark, any more insightful analysis of the underlying meanings behind these series of actions?

Sara's interjection pacifying the situation, Eddie falling for the obvious derision, Bert's intention behind such a comment (which could only have affected the confidence of the player he was investing in, negatively?).

[u/Tropicalgia]

I'd say at that point the two of them recognize they're fighting for control of Eddie and he has value to them for different reasons. She placates him because she cares more about him.

[u/Legal-Dealer-3027 → u/Tropicalgia]

That's interesting, I guess I saw it like Sara was being protective of Eddie, seeing how Bert wanted to control him but ultimately undermine him (which she clarifies later, "he won't break your thumbs, he'll break your heart, your guts, for the same reason; cause he hates you, cause of what you are, cause of what you have and he hasn't".

I guess I saw it like Sara was protecting what she felt was righteous in the face of tyranny, which is ironic cause we ultimately see she was attracted to that oppressive sense of authority that Bert had........ not just by love, but raw sex appeal (in her mind at least).

[u/ImpactNext1283 → u/Legal-Dealer-3027]

Oh, I always felt that she was sabotaging the relationship with Eddie, an extension of the same protective instinct you identify. And ultimately as an act of self-sabotage.

[u/Legal-Dealer-3027 → u/ImpactNext1283]

Sabotaging the relationship with Eddie by fucking Gordon?

lol

I guess exploration of that is another thread in itself, but I saw that like she just couldn't help her own lust, what she perceives as "perverse", she gave into her own perversion.

Lack of impulse control (and sound judgement) is a path to self destruction for sure.

[u/ImpactNext1283 → u/Legal-Dealer-3027]

I was friends for many years with a woman who’s very much like the character. She always cheated, or otherwise sabotaged her relationships - because she felt unworthy of love, or that it was doomed anyways, or because she thought her mental health and addiction issues would ruin it anyway.

Lack of impulse control often leads to self-destructive behavior when paired with low self-esteem. When paired with high self-esteem, it often leads to success.

Sara, I think, demonstrates all of these feelings and behaviors. And all of the characters in the film are fighting their own self-destructive behaviors, I think. At least that’s always how I’ve read the picture.

[u/Tropicalgia → u/Legal-Dealer-3027]

And it destroys her. From the perspective of the story you could say she tries to fight Bert and fails so that Eddie will have a chance to fight for himself, which he must do, to survive.

[u/boomerdeville]

That scene is about Bert attacking Sarah. He's battling for control over Eddie, and Sarah is not only an obstacle, but also direct competition. Bert tries to gaslight Eddie by pretending the remark wasn't intentional, but all three know it was a swipe at Sarah's disability. Eddie sticks up for her, but Sarah takes it in stride, as someone who has heard ignorant insults like that before.

She appears to have lost the battle by getting drunk and making a scene at the party, but she ends up winning by sacrificing herself to save Eddie. She allows Bert to rape her. That sentence may sound like a contradiction, but it's more figurative than literal. If you read the book, Sarah doesn't go on the road trip. Her character was developed and expanded for the film, and the Kentucky trip is all about releasing Eddie from Bert's control, thanks to Sarah's sacrifice.

A hustler gets hustled because of ego. It's an old story about youthful hubris. It's not that Eddie falls for traps. It's that his ego doesn't allow him to back down from a challenge. Consequences be damned. Even in the end, Eddie chooses the opportunity to beat Minnesota Fats, knowing full well he's going to be forever banned from playing in pool halls.

[u/Legal-Dealer-3027 → u/boomerdeville]

Bert tries to gaslight Eddie by pretending the remark wasn't intentional, but all three know it was a swipe at Sarah's disability

Bingo.

I can't actually believe I've watched the film so many times, and missed that.

It wasn't Bert questioning Eddie's hands that caused outrage, but his despicable use of the word "cripple".

I had always assumed Eddie responded so heatedly as it was an attack on he himself (as it was portrayed), but it was an underhanded quip at his partner Sara. Funnily enough, in the scene Sara is introduced to Bert, she noticeably limps (or the film maker incorporates that into the script), making Gordon aware of her disability.

"Are you sure you're going to be comfortable enough there........", is the follow up comment, presumably again making reference to her disability, I'd never realized that's what he was making reference to.

It's not that Eddie falls for traps. It's that his ego doesn't allow him to back down from a challenge

lol, the ART of learning how to be understated in the appropriate situations.

That brute force of pride, ego, being the "alpha dog" in a situation, all necessary qualities for success, but conversely, to dodge the scumbags that try to cut you down, or even being sufficiently level headed when the situation calls for it......... I guess concurrently learning that is an artform in itself, one that Eddie has failed to come to terms with and paid the price for repeatedly, at least in the film.

.......

Did you gather these points from having read the book?

I actually did read it but it was very bland compared to the film so it failed to really get my interest.

[u/boomerdeville → u/Legal-Dealer-3027]

The novel was written like a noir, so I can see how it could seem bland all these decades later. That's understandable. I personally loved the book, though I read it too long ago to recall specific details. I remember it painted Eddie as a more vicious and cold character, which was interesting to me. I believe it spent some time focusing on what it's like to be a hustler and gambler, but I think the film swapped that out for more development of Sarah's character.

As I mentioned, I recall that Sarah's character was limited in the book. She doesn't accompany Eddie and Bert on the Kentucky trip, but she does kill herself after Eddie returns. But that death is more about her personal struggles, and it's not related to Bert at all. The film really fills out Sarah's character, and makes her central to Eddie's arc. In the book, Eddie's arc is basically detached from Sarah.

You're totally right about the ego aspect. What's also interesting to me is The Color of Money. I did not read that book, but the film is great. When we talk about Eddie's ego, it's there again in The Color of Money. It's mirrored in Vincent, but that old hubris pops up again, and Eddie gets hustled because of it. The two movies combined provide a fairly realistic view (as opposed to a romantic view) of a freakishly talented man held back by an oversized ego. His selfishness destroys relationships, and ultimately keeps him below the level he could reach if only he could tame that ego.

Needless to say, Paul Newman as Eddie helps a ton. Perfectly cast.

[u/Legal-Dealer-3027 → u/boomerdeville]

Sarah doesn't go on the road trip. Her character was developed and expanded for the film, and the Kentucky trip is all about releasing Eddie from Bert's control, thanks to Sarah's sacrifice.

Did the book clarify this more overtly?