r/morbidquestions • u/Initial_Humor5460 • 4d ago
How is incest even a thing??
Watching law and order svu duh. How is incest even possible in the natural world? How are animals able to commit incest when it’s so against nature and genetics why are they not natural instincts against that? I know some species of animals avoid incest, but a lot of them don’t. Especially humans! How is it so common? How is there not some biological natural stop sign and alarm signal go off in our heads?? How are some people attracted to it?!?! I dont get it and at the same time its terrifying and im scared everyday ill have diabolical thoughts about my family.
257
u/oldhorsemeat 4d ago
Sex.
40
u/ArchScabby 4d ago
Yeah but also keep the bloodline pure bro
25
6
u/Burntoastedbutter 4d ago
It was common for royalty to commit incest because of that right? Or was I lied to
6
25
u/IsunkTheMayFLOWER 4d ago
An evolutionary adaption that physically prevents sex between those too related by blood would also likely limit the species in other capacities. For example if there was some certain unique chemical that was passed through a family and would slowly change such that 10th cousins 7 times removed would still be able to have sex, but was the same among siblings, and that signal prevented the female eggs from being fertilized when it was detected among the sperm, there would be a lot of potential for mutations that would prevent two non family mates from reproducing, and a lot of things that could go wrong in general, ie what if the chemical just didn't detect? It would require a lot of refining over many generations to get this system correct and it probably wouldn't be worth it for the relatively minor harm it would be getting rid of.
If you mean a natural psychological aversion to incest, well, we sort of already do even beyond cultural influence. There was some study where two siblings smelled each others sweat after working out not knowing it was their sibling and they did have a natural avoidance to it. But still that isn't too strong and can very easily be overcome by culture. I also think the taboo of siblings having sex makes people like it more in some sense, I doubt there are natural attractions to family members in nature as a fetish.
16
65
73
u/Beautiful-Quality402 4d ago
It’s a biological aberration that can be caused by internal and external factors. It’s against life’s nature to kill itself yet people and animals still do exactly that.
26
u/DeepQueen 4d ago
This is just splitting hairs but I'd argue that animal suicide is different from the human version
5
u/Iron0skull 4d ago
I would imagine an animal in pain thats debilitating and doesn't seem to stop would run off a cliff
23
31
u/MightBeAVampire 4d ago
im scared everyday ill have diabolical thoughts about my family.
Hey, I don't know what you may or may not be diagnosed with or if you have a therapist or anything, but this kind of sounds like OCD to me
5
51
u/0wnzl1f3 4d ago
Incest only becomes a problem when you have an understanding of genetics. Without that knowledge, there is no taboo.
It was a major method of maintaining populations in various small or isolated communities.
On an evolutionary scale, there is probably a survival advantage to incest over no incest in the context of a scarcity of partners, and there definitely is a survival advantage in the absence of unrelated partners. Therefore, theres no reason incest would be evolutionarily eliminated.
26
u/Shiiang 4d ago
The Westermarck Effect kicks in before you learn about genetics. It's still a large emotional taboo.
7
u/ozifrage 4d ago
Yep. People tracked this long before DNA was a concept! The degree to which it's been historically accepted, and how far out varies a lot by culture and period. Some were and are fine with cousin marriage, others had laws requiring a certain degree of separation.
7
u/connorgrs 4d ago
You’re forgetting how complex human psychology is
-15
8
u/Spoon_Elemental 4d ago
There are biological measures to stop us from doing it, they just don't work for some people. Biology isn't perfect, and sometimes we have errors in our creation.
11
u/thesheepwhisperer368 4d ago
Incest actually isn't against nature as far as animals go. In fact, the focus on genetics isn't the point either. The point is procreation. Also incest isn't as damaging to a lot of species as it is to humans for example, if I take a pair of rabbits and I make sure they don't have any red flag issues (bad teeth, skeletal deformation, blindness, max factor, etc) i bred them together and then I took a male and female kit from that litter and bred them together it would take dozens of generations to run into issues
3
u/fatman907 3d ago
Here I am with my wobbly bones and leaky blood just feeling like the world hates me.😞
13
u/midnight_rum 4d ago edited 4d ago
Nature isn't some perfect entity, it's just a bunch of shit thrown at the wall. Some of it sticks, some of it don't. Generally humans developed an ick towards the thought of having sex with their family. Some people just don't have it because genetics aren't perfect I guess. We have it because in the past humans with the ick generally outperformed humans without it, that's it
Some species of animals never developed the ick at all. Does it cripple them genetically, and they'd function better if they had the ick? Yeah, most probably. But nature doesn't care, as long as they are able to survive and reproduce, they will reproduce.
Also reproduction process can vary greatly between animals and some don't get the negative effects as strongly
3
u/Irksomecake 4d ago
Elephant seals…. Only the biggest strongest male gets to breed. So every pup in a group has the same father. Every female that breeds is likely to be mating her brother, father or son generation after generation. They survive just fine, but my goodness do they look weird as a result.
7
24
u/Character_Expert7084 4d ago
There is no incest in nature, there is sex.
Having sex with your child is less anti-biological than not having sex.
4
7
3
u/RemarkableCandle7707 3d ago
In humans it’s always related to abuse. I’m a social worker. I remember when I was still studying asking my professor who was a several decades long veteran child protection worker. I asked her if in all her career, all the families she worked with that had incest, was there ever a case where there was nothing coercive or abusive about it? Ie the two siblings for example just did it, she responded with a resounding no. There was always a coercive abusive element. When I started practicing I saw it too. As to how people are attracted to their own family in a sexual way? Rapes always about power and control. It’s not about attraction. It’s the same thing when you see very old women get sexually assaulted, like ancient women in their 90s. Power and control.
2
u/RogueNarc 3d ago
Doesn't your work bias your dataset? Successful invest would necessarily be unnoticed incest
2
u/RemarkableCandle7707 3d ago
It remains a power and control abuse thing even when it goes undetected.
3
u/PineappleIsForLosers 2d ago
There are biological stops to it, but they're behavioural, not physiological. Evolution finds the easiest path to a solution, and behavioural changes (like male lions being kicked out of the pride after a certain age) or psychological changes (like humans tending to feel disgust at the idea of sleeping with someone they've grown up around) are simply easier to evolve rather than something that makes ot impossible
3
u/-imagenotfound 1d ago
It sounds like you have anxiety. Maybe ocd. People aren't usually afraid that they'll have sexual thoughts about family members. It isn't something that they have to suppress. You should move out.
9
9
u/bouncynarwhal 4d ago
I mean, people get off to weird things, it’s the taboo of it I suppose
1
u/DivineDubhain 4d ago
I don't see anything wrong with taboos as long as they stay in the realm of fantasy, or safe and consensual if not.
2
u/TubularBrainRevolt 3d ago
Humans generally avoid incest. I don’t know how you reached the opposite conclusion. Most humans tend not to view people they have grown up with as potential partners, no matter if they’re related. Then there are various cultural taboos above it. Most animals tend to avoid inbreeding as well. They may not get attracted to individuals similar to them, or they may employ other methods, such as migration away from their natal territory.
3
u/Shiiang 4d ago
There's a difference between consensual and non-consensual incest.
Non-con incest is the predominant type. In animals it's based on evolutionary drives to survive, as well as pleasure - the same that leads animals to rape other animals.
Consensual incest is very rare, and arguably never actually consensual - most of the time there's high levels of grooming or trauma involved.
1
u/cc3c3 4d ago
most incest is just rape between adult and related children or children molested by older siblings/cousins. the rarer, 'consensual' forms are grooming and isolation. family ties is why most incidents aren't reported to the police even when children confessed, because both the victims and their family they don't want to ruin their family / family member's reputation / life. sometimes the victim still loves the abusing family member in spite of the abuse which leads to confusing emotions that are easier to suppress than confront.
5
u/rrrrrig 4d ago
It takes quite a few generations of incest for it to really make a difference. Animals don't care because it doesn't really matter. They don't have social conventions like we do. Your littermate isn't a sibling because you don't have siblings, there are just other dogs. It's really not unnatural or against nature or genetics. Animals often leave their parents by the time they're sexually mature which naturally reduces incest but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It should certainly be avoided (and I think the human revulsion towards it, whether innate or learned, is good) whenever possible but it's not 'unnatural' or really that wrong in the grand scheme of things.
1
u/Uhhlaneuh 4d ago
My friend is a social worker and said incest is very common in sexual abuse situations. The reason, I don’t know.
2
u/nobearpineapples 4d ago
Animals don’t care, and it takes a few generations to really get bad
With humans my guess, 1.they’re already inbred so it’s normalized most/all their person life, 2. the taboo aspect, 3. Step siblings/incest porn sexualizing the general idea of incest, 4. They just don’t care, humans and werid and horny, not a good combo.
I’m also high and guessing
1
u/Pale-Magician-3299 3d ago
i’d love to know what episode you watched that triggered this thought. i haven’t watched in quite awhile.
1
u/UltraDucks895 2d ago
Not OP but guessing it was the one about the girl who had a baby in her dorm and dumped him, then when they found out it was her father who had fathered the kid and everything was "consensual". Googled to find out that's S7E14 "Taboo".
I like SVU, thats one of the episodes that stuck with more because the whole situation was so messed up.
1
2
u/BoeserAuslaender 2d ago
It's not "against nature". It's harmful in the long run, but there are some species that either have so small populations there are no other options, or on the opposite, produce so huge amounts of offspring that individual lives don't matter.
1
u/Comprehensive_Tour23 1d ago
You’re “scared everyday” that you’ll have inappropriate thoughts about members of your family? This is a daily concern?
1
u/ninthhellcircle 4d ago
You can't really stop lust, but your rationality and morals help you regulate it. Frankly speaking, I find my mom thicc and hot sometimes and I could pounce her when I want, but I never did thanks to my rationality. People only act on them if they succumb to their instincts and desire and don't consider morality.
1
1
u/AdministrativeStep98 4d ago
Some animals are inbred at an alarming rate so tbh, I believe that every existing specie will have inbreeding or forms of incest, including humans
1
u/DivineDubhain 4d ago
I'm just interested in the taboo aspect of it (fiction only, obviously) 🤷🏻♂️
1
u/chelsea-from-calif 3d ago
As long as no one gets pregnant I don't really get why it's so frowned about.
-2
-2
-38
u/CoffinBlz 4d ago edited 4d ago
Maybe we're missing out and because they're related the genitals are naturally shaped to each other and it feels amazing. I wonder what my sister is upto later.
Edit... Downvote all you want you bunch of wet little lettuce.
20
7
-10
-1
312
u/Potential-Prize1741 4d ago edited 4d ago
For humans there is an instinct of disgust people have(even when not related) if they grew up together/as a family. But that is likely mostly a human psychological reaction.
For the most part,quite honestly incest isn't big enough of a problem for nature to make a biological 'stop' to it. For that to happen incest would need to be way more common and impact the continuation of the species,and even then is not guaranteed a biological response would appear. So far it impacts gene pools yes but only after a few generations of inbreeding it actually gets very bad and by then someone new is generally added to the pool. And this is generally on a relatively small group of people or happening here and there. Some species are also affected way more than others by a lack of gene pools,some species are completely fine for long generations. Long term effects on a whole species from this doesn't really happen.
So to answer your question, incest isn't enough against nature for nature to care about its existence,cause is just not that important to it.