r/science • u/informationtiger • Dec 18 '19

Chemistry Nicotine formula used by e-cigarette maker Juul is nearly identical to the flavor and addictive profile of Marlboro cigarettes

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-juul-ecigarettes-study-idUSKBN1YL26R
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u/mangeek Dec 18 '19

I used to smoke about half a pack a day, which wasn't much, but I couldn't run two blocks. Now I JUUL about a pod and a half a day, which is a lot more nicotine, but I can bang out seven minute miles.

I don't know any athletic smokers, none. I know plenty of athletic vapers.

I think it's pretty obvious that vaping is less harmful. My concern is how harmful it might still be though. I definitely notice dry mouth and can only assume it sort of does the same to my lungs and airways, so it's not the same as not vaping, but it does have effects. I'm guessing the overall risk is something on the order of 1/50th to 1/10th of smoking. We need more time and studies, and we need studies that parse out people who vape all sorts of stuff from those sticking to just nicotine salts from tier-1 products.

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u/katyfail Dec 18 '19

As it was explained to me by one of my state's public health scientists, smoking is one thing and vaping is a totally different thing. From their perspective, calling it "vaping" is misleading since that invokes something less harmful like water vapor. In reality, the scientists I spoke to would prefer it had a name closer to huffing since that's factually closer to what's going on. You may not be burning something, but you're still inhaling dangerous chemicals and it's still having a negative impact on your body.

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u/lejefferson Dec 18 '19

I’m sorry but that’s dumb and propagandist. Just because you’re not inhaling only water vapor doesn’t mean you’re not inhaling vapor. It’s still vapor.

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u/katyfail Dec 18 '19

No one said it isn't vapor, although I'd strongly disagree that it's "dumb" or "propagandist".

The point is that it's been marketed as a healthy alternative and plays on the idea of water vapor when that's not what it is. It's a chemical vapor, similar to what you inhale when huffing things like computer duster or paint thinner.

Edit: clarification

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u/mangeek Dec 19 '19

It's not at all similar to huffing. I can't speak to what's in weird off-brand stuff, but a gram of propylene glycol a day and the same flavor additives used in candy, along with 50-75mg of nicotine probably aren't going to be terribly harmful, and definitely aren't anything like inhaling stuff that's straight-up poisonous like paint propellant or burning leaves.

I don't align with vape-bros, but let's use some common sense here. Inhaling a vaporized jelly bean a day isn't good for you, but it's not anywhere in the ballpark of a gram of spray paint or a burning deck of cards.

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u/katyfail Dec 19 '19

The definition of huffing is "inhaling chemical vapors". By that definition, and by your own description, it is the exact same as vaping. The *probably * you put there is such an overstatement as to be misleading. The issue this particular scientist took was with the marketing behind the idea of vapor to young people who didn't take the time to research or understand the risks.

It is unknown what impact the chemicals in vaping have on health - particularly in developing bodies and brains. Because vaping is so new that there is no long term data. That being said, we know nicotene is both highly addictive and related to heart and lung issues.

Not as harmful as something else doesn't make it safe.

Source: https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/5-truths-you-need-to-know-about-vaping

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u/mangeek Dec 19 '19

The difference between 'huffing', as the term is used (e.g., inhaling ridiculously toxic fumes to get high) vs. 'vaping' is like taking a shot of methanol every day vs. a shot or ethanol. Both are 'drinking alcohol', but one is going to mess you up a LOT more.