r/politics • u/PoliticsModeratorBot đ¤ Bot • 17h ago
Discussion Discussion Thread: US Senate Debates and Considers the Republican Budget Resolution on April 4th, 2025
News and Analysis
CBS: Senate Republicans unveil budget resolution key to unlocking Trump agenda (Published two days ago)
NBC: GOP concerns about tax cut strategy and Medicaid loom over Senate budget
ABC: Video: Senate Republicans set to push Trump agenda forward with vote-a-rama
Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget: Senate Budget Could Enable Unprecedented Deficit Increase
Live Updates
Relevant text-based, live update pages are being maintained by the following outlets: NBC, and Politico (soft paywall).
Where to Watch
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u/elammcknight 40m ago
Can someone makes sure Cory Booker is well hydrated and ready To GO! We be needing his spirit right about now!
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u/Wisconsinsteph 2h ago
We need to start holding all of our local politicians accountable there needs to be some firing going on holding higher up politicians accountable the nation has to be in a complete uproar. Something needs to happen. All I know is Iâm terrified if something doesnât
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u/Wisconsinsteph 3h ago
Raise the debt limit I thought he was going to get rid of a lot of the debt what happened to that?
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u/TheDawnOfShe 3h ago
I mean if republicans are nuking senate rules then dems can reverse this with 50 if we ever get free elections again.
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u/Embarrassed-Track-21 2h ago
The Dems donât want a viable alternative if this. How many more years of this political dynamic do you need to witness?
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u/brain_overclocked 5h ago
New Projected Cost of Trump-GOP Tax Cuts for the Rich: 'Staggering' $7 Trillion
The analysis from the nonpartisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT), published on Thursday, updates previous estimates that suggested the GOP effort to extend expiring provisions of the 2017 law would cost $4.6 trillion over a 10-year period. The new assessment shows that extending the law's temporary provisionsâwhich disproportionately favored the wealthyâwould cost $5.5 trillion over the next decade.
The projected cost of the GOP agenda balloons to $7 trillion after adding Senate Republicans' call for $1.5 trillion in additional tax cuts in the budget resolution they advanced in a party-line vote on Thursday. The GOP has come under fire for using an accounting trick to claim their proposed tax cuts would have no budgetary impact.
Senate Republicans set to bypass parliamentarian on Trump tax cuts
Republicans are set to make the audacious play of bypassing the Senate parliamentarian and moving forward with a budget resolution based on a scoring baseline set by Budget Committee Chair Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) that would allow them to argue extending President Trumpâs 2017 tax cuts wonât add to the deficit.
The analysis by Joint Committee on Taxation:
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u/nerphurp 4h ago
During 2021 battles to raise the minimum wage and advance the Build Back Better agenda, congressional Democrats refused to "ignore" the unelected U.S. Senate parliamentarian
A reminder that they chose to modify or abandon their agendas based on the the rules.
At the time, 'it'll open the door to Republicans doing it in the future' was the response to the progressives telling them to just do it
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u/nerphurp 8h ago
Say what you will about Rand Paul, but he's consistent. Republicans just treat it as "boys will be boys."
The House fiscal hawks back down everytime.
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u/legbreaker 10h ago edited 10h ago
I donât get why the democrats arenât blowing up the news with the 5-7 Trillion dollar deficit increase that the senate is proposing.
It is such a monstrosity. The GOP voters hate the deficit, but somehow their politicians are getting away with blowing up the debt limit for billionaire tax cuts at the same time they are crashing the economy.
There is no world where this makes any logical sense. No GOP voter wants this.
Itâs such an easy point to hit them hard with.
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u/Wisconsinsteph 3h ago
Yes they can raise all these campaign funds but we canât raise enough money to spam the hell out of social media and commercials and such?? With actual facts that they canât well they can deny but canât prove and we can. I donât understand why more is not being done.
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u/nerphurp 9h ago edited 8h ago
It's not getting covered, nor will it except for late night comedy talk shows and MSNBC/CNBC
The rest will follow later with panels of 'both sides' with a MAGA talking head shouting over everyone to explain why it's good.
It's a lonely journey being politically informed unless it's pertinent to your career.
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u/phoenixmatrix 9h ago
but but DOGE saved so much money! /s
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u/rumbleokc05 7h ago
Doge has accounted for a 140 billion in savings. Is the amount not considered âso much moneyâ? In curiosity what is that number? One that qualifies as âso muchâ.
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u/nasorrty346tfrgser 5m ago
Look up the Treasury website, it published everyday US gov spending. You can see there is no changes at all comparing to last year.
Or you wanna say "Is just 70 days give them a break"? Then don't swing around with the 140 B savings everywhere.
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u/pmotiveforce 5h ago
Lol, according to what? Doge?
DOGE does not save money at all. Congress is the only entity that can save money. If Trump was serious he would have had a real Doge prepare a giant report with specific instances of waste to present to Congress.
Be he's not a serious person so he sells the gullible and the credulous a line of garbage via press releases and fake numbers.
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u/PA_Irredentist Pennsylvania 9h ago
Republican voters don't give a crap about the deficit. It's an instrumental value that they espouse to tear down the social safety net.
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u/putin_my_ass 10h ago
I donât get why the democrats arenât blowing up the news with the 5-7 Trillion dollar deficit increase that the senate is proposing.
The news is choosing not to cover this.
Somehow, yet again, all of this is the Democrats.
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u/killercurvesahead I voted 7h ago
first of all, youâre not wrong.
But they could (should!!) be getting on the news on the pretext of discussing anything and changing the subject live on air. Control the message. Be overbearing if you have to. You know, the way Republicans always do.
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u/legbreaker 9h ago
Yeah, news is not covering it is bad. But the democrats are the ones that benefit the most from this.
The media picks up controversy. They should be making statements. Going on site and calling a press conference at a site that is at threat of going out of business because of the tariffs.
Create the news for them.
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u/HellaTroi California 11h ago
""It was another highly successful week for the American people as President Donald J. Trump continues his relentless pursuit of strength, prosperity, and peace â and lays the foundation for America to be the global powerhouse for generations to come," the White House said."
Laying the groundwork for America to be a global powerhouse by removing access to goods and materials that can't be sourced domestically.
Nice job, moron đ
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u/AHotDodgerDog 11h ago
Trump was right! He said if I voted for Harris that the economy would crash and America would lose respect around the world. I voted for Harris and sure enough!
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u/-SosaSnipes- New York 13h ago
If elections still exist a year and half from now and by some miracle have not been made more difficult to participate in than they currently are, the GOP is going to get wiped off the face of the earth in the 2026 midterms.
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u/lynch527 8h ago
All the GOP has to do is say SOROS made all the bad things happen and theyll fall in line, again.
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u/creepyaliengirl 5h ago
Bessent is pretty tight with Soros I heard idk pretty sure all the billionaires got fingers in this cookie jar atm
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u/insideout_waffle Texas 11h ago
Sadly, you underestimate the power of stupidity. GOP brought us here twice already. We had a second chance to decide ânot this time.â But here we are.
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u/fertthrowaway 10h ago
I dunno, almost no one alive today has experienced an economic depression. I don't think it will be so forgettable. Republicans were in power for 3 presidencies for 8 years before the Great Depression started (Harding, Coolidge, and Hoover). Then FDR (D) was president for 12 years fixing that shit.
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u/jgandfeed I voted 10h ago
Uhh...2008 was not THAT long ago....
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u/fertthrowaway 9h ago
2008 was a RECESSION. I said DEPRESSION. I've lived through 5 recessions personally, not counting whatever it's been post-COVID. And I think those are all nothing compared to what's coming.
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u/insideout_waffle Texas 10h ago
Recession not depression (a depression is far worse, but hey, here we go! đ˘)
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u/shunted22 12h ago
And it'll be like the Iraq war where everyone pretends they were against it all along
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u/Spicy_Pancake1 Maryland 13h ago
For the time being it appears Rand Paul still expects elections to continue. He said last time tariffs happened, republicans lost the senate and house for 60 years. Him being so worried is the only thing keeping me hopeful.
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u/Few_Sale_3064 11h ago
When Republicans aren't happy that usually means something good just happened.
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u/KrankyKoot 13h ago
Somebody posted the plan that with a recession the fed will be forced to lower rates which would allow the debt to be refinanced allowing room for his tax cuts. And he supposedly cheered the idea. I couldn't find the post but absolutely would expect this from him. He's already bitching that they aren't cutting.
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u/Adventurous-Tone-311 13h ago
Yeah that's not how that works. If the economy continues down this path, rates will never be cut and may potentially rise.
When the banks take greater risk in lending money, naturally rates go up. It's insane to me that Trump doesn't understand this simple concept.
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u/Embarrassed-Track-21 2h ago
Letâs be realistic, banks above a certain size in America donât face risk anymore and havenât for a long time.
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u/beamrider 11h ago
Lower rates means he owes less on his loans. Therefore, for the good of the country, since he is literally the Physical Embodyment of the United States, rates should go down. /s
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u/AHotDodgerDog 12h ago
Add to that: tariffs on their own cause inflation. The fed isnât cutting rates if inflation is going up.
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u/catjuggler 14h ago edited 13h ago
Is Bernie doing a Booker right now? I'm confused
ETA to be more specific, there's a youtube channel that seems to have him having been talking for hours, but CSPAN just started a few minutes ago. Same clothes. Both say they're live. I don't understand
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u/VoraciousChallenge 12h ago
That YouTube channel appears to be just looping a speech he gave two weeks ago. The stream says it started on the 25th, so presumably it's just been looping ever since.
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u/HellaTroi California 14h ago
I would say we should give them enough rope to hang themselves, but looks like they're going to hang us all along with them.
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u/-ZeroF56 14h ago
Thatâs the whole plan, or so it seems. Crash the market and let the rich buy what little bit of it they didnât already have for pennies on the dollar.
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u/Tmscott 13h ago
Its as if the top richest men in the world doubled their fortunes doing exactly this during the pandemic while the rest of us took losses some of us are just recovering from.
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u/HellaTroi California 11h ago
After the 2008 financial disaster at the end of G W Bush 2nd term.
So many people lost their homes and savings. The hedge funds bought up all that property and raised the rents beyond people's means to pay.
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u/Future_Constant6520 14h ago
This is a big plan to tank the market and give a massive tax cut to the wealthy to allow them the opportunity to do a massive buy back.
Trump will leverage tariffs to increase his influence and power with other nations. After the buy backs have taken place heâll adjust his tariff policy and it will be business as usual. This is all a scam to create another massive transfer of wealth up to the top. The tax cuts arenât enough. They want it all.
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u/Few_Sale_3064 11h ago
The working class has to make their money less powerful, like boycotting and refusing their dirty money thrown at people for voting or signing petitions.
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u/AHotDodgerDog 12h ago
I feel like this is giving him too much credit as a âplanner.â
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u/Future_Constant6520 6h ago
I donât think youâre giving him enough credit. We all knew about project 2025 and despite playing dumb on the campaign trail heâs carrying it out better than the architects ever dreamed.
Part of his strategy is to have you believe heâs dumb and not capable of carrying out this authoritarian agenda.
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u/namastayhom33 Connecticut 14h ago
I'm just gonna throw this out there that the U.S. might default on its debt by August if nothing gets done.
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u/mmlauren35 15h ago
How permanent and detrimental is everything heâs doing? Say we have a democratic president in 4 years. When can I expect to feel normal again? đ
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u/wheatrich 13h ago edited 13h ago
based on previous precedent for this roughly 20 years from now
if you mean US world power terms, that's dead and gone for good now. Every world power in history when they lost it they never got it back.
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u/arrivederci117 New York 14h ago
If the next election is going to be another 49.5% nail biter where people have to wait until all of the votes are completely tallied because it's so close, I doubt any country will trust us again, that's assuming we even have elections by the.
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u/HellaTroi California 13h ago
If Trump gets his way, many people will be prevented from voting at all. Votes mailed on election day but not received yet will not be counted. Mail in voting could be ruled illegal as well.
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u/loglighterequipment California 12h ago
Trump will be so unpopular by then that even Reublicans would riot if they fucked with the election.
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u/HellaTroi California 11h ago
I hope you are right. It seems a few are wavering slightly, but the bad times are on the way.
I can't even look at my 401k right now.
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u/loglighterequipment California 11h ago
Don't look, but do up your contributions. I raised mine a couple weeks ago when it became clear he was dead serious about tanking the economy.
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u/Ready_Nature 14h ago
The rest of the world will not trust us again. They know any deal is at best good until the next election
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u/Mnudge 14h ago
Whatâs really depressing is that the US has had it good and the idiots on both sides assumed it would last forever.
Through money, power and military might we controlled the world.
That shit is done. The right has slammed isolationism right into their vein with a massive delusion that the US is the power they were in the last century
Theyâll move on without us.
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u/belisario262 14h ago
indeed. we're already doing it. is true, it won't be the same for the US even if they are able to throw Trump out in 4 years.
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u/GaimeGuy Minnesota 14h ago edited 14h ago
it's going to take a protracted 30-50 year run of democratic control and stable leadership on the national and international stage - think new deal coalition - to fix america's image.
As for our standing in terms of power? It's gone, permanently. We aren't going to see a world where the United States has the soft power it used to have. After Bush, the world forgave us for sending their people to die based on lies about afghanistan and iraq. After Trump 1, the world held its breath and prayed it was a fluke, a moment of stupidity. After Trump 2, the world is angry with us and with themselves for being stupid enough to trust us, and to give us preferential treatment.
For instance, Canada sold oil to the US at a discount. That's going to be gone. Some produce from Mexico was sold to the US at a discount because of the size of the US market. That's probably going to be gone, too. We spent that goodwill.
You'll see US bases all over the world shut down, so the US will have fewer ports to distribute supplies for military and even humanitarian purposes from. This will limit the reach of our influence, geographically speaking, and we'll have diminished presence and visibility.
China will increase its diplomatic ties with Japan, South Korea, Indonesia, and Australia. US will lose preferential treatment for international consumer tech (You know how a lot of the times, the US would get t tech and video games before Europe? That was because of trade deals).
And so on.
You might see nuclear proliferation spread to dozens of countries. Iran, Iraq, Brazil, Argentina, Italy, Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Ukraine, and some other nations, have had nuclear weapons or nuclear weapons programs/plans previouusly, but were largely discouraged from armanent through american soft power on the international stage.
Canada is having very real talks to build nuclear weapons, and i'm sure, behind the scenes, they're talking about holding france and UK nukes in the mean time, to deter against the American threat.
The damage being done is ginormous and will have profound ramifications for decades to come
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u/belisario262 13h ago
I fully agree with your analysis on this, the US stopped being the main power, and by its own will, lost his place at the top. now the power vacuum will be filled mainly by China - regarding soft power - and the brain drain will be absorbed also by China and also Europe, which means the US will be finally losing for good any I+D advantage it yet had. geopolitically the power is shifting towards China too, with Europe trying to keep up.
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u/bh97213 14h ago
While I agree with many of your points above, I doubt the US will shut down bases since there is a lot of corporate profits to be had in keeping those bases, as well as keeping the war machine going.
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u/GaimeGuy Minnesota 14h ago
It doesn't matter what we want. what matters is if other countries will tolerate having a foreign military that could turn hostile because the president changes every 4 years with a foothold in their territory. They have the right to kick us out if they want. And they should. And they will.
âWe cannot leave the security of Europe in the hands of voters in Wisconsin every 4 years,â - Emmanuel Macron.
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u/belisario262 13h ago
fully agreed. the US will be treated more and more like a foreign menace. and yeah, they will be kicked out of many places. we're so used to think about the US as this privileged country that can do anything they want, that is hard to see it as a "regular" country with normal boundaries and limitations.
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u/JadedIT_Tech Georgia 15h ago
The good news: No damage of this kind of permanent.
The bad news: It's going to take a really fucking long time to fix. And the more bullshit he pulls, the longer it's going to take.
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u/OnDrugsTonight United Kingdom 14h ago
I'd say the re-establishment of economic ties and removal of tariffs could happen pretty much instantaneously. Hell, nobody wanted this trade war in the first place, so we're all standing by for the US to snap out of it.
Other damages may be a lot harder to repair. America's loss of soft power through the abolishment of USAID means that by 2028 other players (mainly China) will have filled the vacuum left behind by America's withdrawal from the world stage, and countries around the globe will have entered into comfortable long term economic partnerships with China that they will be reluctant (or unable) to abandon.
Same with NATO. While it'd be good to temporarily have some sanity back in the White House, we'd be crazy to trust America again in the same way we did before. "Fool me once" etc. Knowing that every four years it'll be a roll of a dice whether or not we're still allies doesn't lend itself well to making strategic military decisions that are measured in decades. So the European side of NATO will probably be a lot more inward looking than it was before.
All of this obviously hinges on the rather optimistic assumption that you guys will still have meaningful, democratic elections in 2028.
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u/NeverForgetChainRule 14h ago
Regarding international relations, he probably has done damage that isnt reparable in the near future (near future being, say a dem wins in 2028 and for their whole first term). I'm sure theyll remove any tarrifs trump hasnt himself by then, and other nations likely will remove retalitory ones, and im sure the US will begin working with other nations again in places Trump is refusing, but I'd expect (and honestly hope) that the rest of the world will treat the US a bit differently with how bad one of our parties is in regards to international relations. At any point in 4 years, all of it can be clicked back on.
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u/chowderbags American Expat 10h ago
Even if tariffs are removed, companies are going to be reluctant to include the US in their supply chains. Why take the risk if there's a 50-50 shot that America elects another lunatic and trade gets fucked again? The only way someone would bother is if the America side puts in a steep discount to make it worth the risk, which means the American economy will suffer long after the tariffs are gone.
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u/cartwheel_123 10h ago
America is the targarayean dynasty. It's a coin flip if the president will be insane.Â
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u/PeterVenkmanIII 14h ago
The good news: No damage of this kind of permanent.
I disagree with this. The tarriffs can be undone, but the damage this will do to the world economy - and America's standing in the world - will be permanent.
I don't know how other countries will be able to trust the US government to keep the most simple of promises after Trump. The damage being done to our reputation - which wasn't doing that great to begin with - will be hard to fix.
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u/Kimber85 North Carolina 13h ago
I was just in Central America on vacation and almost all the locals we talked to eventually got around to the current political situation in the US and how badly it was going to affect them and the rest of the world. They were eager to talk to us once they found out we hated Trump, but you could feel their hesitancy to actually talk to us frankly until they felt us out a bit first.
I think I heard, âAmerica is kind of crazy right now, no?â more than I heard anything else on our whole trip.
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u/secretlyjudging 14h ago
Define permanent. Because thereâs lots of stuff thatâs gonna take years to get back.
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u/pandorasaurus California 15h ago
He threatened tariffs during the campaign right? Iâm perplexed why everyone is shocked it happened. Maybe we werenât sure it would apply other nations, but we knew China as always going to be tariffed.
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u/ratedsar I voted 6h ago edited 6h ago
And during the VP debate, in reference to the Trump economic plan, Vance said "don't trust the experts (economists), trust "common" sense"
Because Vance was running on 4% unemployment, global supply chains, the most trusted currency, the best inflation adjusted wage growth in 50 years,, a reducing deficit, the softest landing after COVID, and generally stable monetary policy (under Biden and Obama before Trump) being bad - and apparently people bought it
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u/NumeralJoker 5h ago
That's what kills me.
The inflation people hated was mostly corporate price gouging. It was very artificial and it was actually reversing towards the end of Biden's term on at least some essentials. I wasn't as well off as 2018 fiscally, but I was moving in that direction with a better career path.
Now? I literally have no idea if any of that will exist a year from now. What Trump's doing is that insanely stupid, and the jobs that they claim will be created, either won't exist at all, or will become sweatshop levels of labor with 0 protections.
If we don't legally counter this and quickly, America truly will flip to third world status or worse.
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u/PomfAndCircvmstance Nevada 14h ago
The media lied about it and downplayed it to make it seem less stupid/insane and make Trump look more normal. It worked because the average American is stupid and lazy.
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u/Guanaco_1 Washington 15h ago
Oh the Jim Cramers of the world pooh poohed it. Stupid ass Boomers screw us yet again.
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u/toxic_badgers Colorado 15h ago
Between this and the tarriffs, its catestrophic. But hey if we're going to get another depression on our 100 year cycle, lets make this one the greatest depression.
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u/silent_thinker 14h ago
The most beautiful, bigliest depression.
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u/gangstasadvocate 14h ago
People, with tears in their eyes and slits in their wrists come up to me, saying, sir, sir! Itâs the greatest depression weâve ever seen and felt
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u/IvantheGreat66 16h ago
What changes were made to the House bill?
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u/SpaceElevatorMusic Minnesota 16h ago
This link from the discussion thread post gets into that: https://www.crfb.org/blogs/senate-budget-could-enable-unprecedented-deficit-increase
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u/obiouslymag1c 16h ago
The USD tanking is also unwelcome as it adds an extra bit of F U to all of us.
e.g. USD/EUR on Jan 20 2025 = 1/.98 - USD/EUR on April 04 2025 = 01/.91
- Bottle of french wine that costs 100 Euro Jan 25 2025 = $104
- Bottle of french wine that costs 100 Euro April 04 2025 = $131.06
Effectively a 26% increase since DJT came to office. (20% tariff / 6% currency)
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u/Prayer_Warrior21 Minnesota 12h ago
I was in Europe this time last year and it felt so cheap with the EUR basically 1:1 with USD.
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u/mbene913 I voted 16h ago
Any politician that isn't voting to end these tariffs shouldn't be allowed to hold office
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u/SUNTAN_1 17h ago
The way he talks about tariffs as if they are an infinite money glitch --- "We are gonna charge THEM using these tariffs!" and is so consistent with that messaging as if he almost believes it, is almost just as psycho as "We're building a wall, and Mexico is gonna pay for it!"
Note that the "Mexico is gonna pay for it!" part was a distraction, designed to obfuscate confuse and bamboozle --- because his REAL goal was to be able to get Congress to cough up taxpayer funding for a 300 billion dollar construction project where HE would get to hand-pick and choose all the contractors and subcontractors.
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And now, tariffs. Let's simplify it, with washing machines.
(a) Five million Americans want to buy a washing machine for cleaning their clothes. They could "buy American" for $1200, or buy one imported from China for $600. EVERYONE buys the $600 washing machine.
(b) Trump announces 50 percent tariff on washing machines.
(c) HOME DEPOT, LOWES or whoever sells washing machines, keeps buying washing machines from China, but now sells them for $900 --- still cheaper than an American-made washing machine.
(d) The American Consumer ends up paying the higher price.
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u/Zealot_Alec 7h ago
30 Rock the American made furniture plotline
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u/SUNTAN_1 7h ago
Jack's Mission: Jack is tasked with making KouchTown, GE's terrible furniture division, profitable.
The Angle: His big marketing push is to heavily emphasize that KouchTown furniture is "Made in America." He tries to leverage patriotism and the idea of supporting American manufacturing.
The Problem: The KouchTown furniture is revealed to be absolutely awful â uncomfortable, poorly constructed, potentially dangerous, and generally hideous.
The Comedy: The humor comes from Jack's increasingly desperate attempts to sell this demonstrably bad product solely on the "Made in America" angle, highlighting the clash between patriotic marketing spin and terrible product quality.
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u/Scooby_dood California 15h ago
You're missing a key part. The components, even if the washer is 'made in the US' are coming from other countries. So, the US washing machine is still going to go up in price because the components are more expensive.
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u/rosie666 13h ago
But how long could it possibly take to build a washing-machine parts factory, 2 weeks, 3 weeks tops?
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u/tapwater86 Pennsylvania 16h ago
And even if he applied large enough tariffs for American made goods to become cheap enough for companies to consider moving manufacturing and jobs back to the US:
He's proven he can change his mind on applying tariffs and their amount on whim
He's applied all of these via Executive Authority which can easily be overturned by the next president if we ever have one
No sane company is going to start making investments that will take multiple years to pay off when there's a chance that it all is for nothing.
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u/NumeralJoker 5h ago
And with the Republicans in charge, those jobs will end up being sweatshop style positions anyway because there will be 0 effective protections in the labor market.
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u/sirbissel 17h ago
Or say there's the Chinese washing machine for $600, and the American one is for $750, tariffs hit, the Chinese machine is pushed up to $900 - so the American one decides they can slightly undercut the Chinese model but make a better profit and start selling them for $850.
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u/catjuggler 13h ago
What will happen a lot of the time (and with pretty much everything I sell in my ecommerce business) is the China COGS are $3->$4, the US COGS don't exist but let's pretend they're $6, so now everything just costs a dollar more and nothing moves locations. The only way for a tariff to cause a move in manufacturing is if the tariff makes the American built cost less, and if it isn't high ENOUGH to do that, it won't do anything but raise costs. Maybe there are some niches where the COGS are close, it's jobs americans actually want, and where using actual strategy could have cause tariffs or incentives to move manufacturing. Or wait, wasn't that what we were doing with electric car batteries and that got cancelled? Hm
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u/RTPGiants North Carolina 15h ago
What actually happens is that some of those 5 million people now decide they don't need a washing machine after all. So only 4 million buy them. This cuts demand for washing machines which in turn means everyone involved in the manufacture, delivery, and sales of the washing machine feels a pinch. This leads to layoffs.
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u/Ferelar New Jersey 6h ago
Which causes any domestic washing machine companies to not expand, but contract as they don't see a viable demand for their good. They lay off their workers. Those workers stop spending quite as much money because now that they're laid off and prices are rising, every dollar is precious. All of the companies that were selling goods to these people now aren't making a sale, so they lose a lot of money and have to contract and lay off their work force....
This sort of deadly cycle is the kind of thing that economists absolutely dread. It's essentially the worst possible man-made disaster that can occur economically, a literal war would probably be less disastrous.
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u/say_no_to_shrugs 16h ago
Except the American company canât raise the price and make a higher profit, because these tariffs arenât on just on manufactured goods like a normal tariff, theyâre also on the commodities and sub manufactured parts, so the price of everything goes up, and the consumer pays nearly as much of a tariff on the American washer.
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u/sirbissel 16h ago
In truth, yes, but I was just making a simple illustration of why even things 100% manufactured here are likely to go up in price due to the tariffs on their competitors.
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u/share_my_filthywife 16h ago
I donât see enough people talking about this, do folks really believe that if the cost of a European car rises by a few thousand dollars, the US made ones will stay the same price?
If you do, Iâve got a bridge to sell you!
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u/scoobysnackoutback 15h ago
40-50% of the parts used to manufacture American made cars are made outside of the US. By the way, 1 in 8 jobs are connected to the auto business.
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u/Ferelar New Jersey 6h ago
And even if we still only look at imported goods, a 50% tariff doesn't mean ONLY a 50% raise in price. There are a lot of pieces of the supply chain, and each little middle man tends to upcharge- often based on the value of the good. So if your tariff increases the price of the good at the import point, that percentage is borne through each of the middlemen who take their slightly higher cut each. So a 50% tariff could end up causing a 60% price hike or more very, very easily- even before we factor in the price gouging that could be done.
And then there's a whole 'nother angle aside from things getting pricier.... tariffs will cause a lot of companies to just stop exporting to the US because it's no longer economically viable. So you might not end up paying more for your favorite brand... because you might no longer SEE your favorite brand.
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u/EWAINS25 17h ago
He does believe it.
People keep trying to ascribe some grand plan to him.
There is none.
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u/bigfatgeekboy 16h ago
The grand plan is mostly about patronage. "Want me to exempt your products from the tariffs? Well whaddya gonna do for me?" Lather, rinse, repeat....
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u/TechnicianExtreme200 16h ago
It shouldn't matter WHY he's doing this. If people assume it's just stupidity (the left), or explain it away as part of some benevolent grand plan because they don't want to admit they got conned (the right), then he'll get away with it. And then he'll do more of it and things will keep getting worse. You know, like what happened with Hitler. People need to step up and fight back, not excuse all of these actions as one time fuckups. I believe Elon Musk was actually correct in some sense and leaked a spoiler when he said empathy is a weakness that liberals have: people with empathy let stupidity and incompetence slide easily, because we've all made mistakes, and treat others how we'd treat ourselves.
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u/pypeDrem 17h ago
The grand plan is to pump all the billionaires with money and then dump the USA for more friendly territory.
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u/ElderSmackJack 14h ago
Thatâs nonsense. There is no plan. He literally thinks this will make us better. Heâs an idiot.
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u/PoliticsModeratorBot đ¤ Bot 17h ago
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