Twin study suggests rationality and intelligence share the same genetic roots - the study suggests that being irrational, or making illogical choices, might simply be another way of measuring lower intelligence.

[u/mvea]

https://www.psypost.org/twin-study-suggests-rationality-and-intelligence-share-the-same-genetic-roots/

[u/Sinai]

It doesn't take much reading between the lines to see that the author thought the very suggestion of general intelligence and rationality being anything but highly correlated was absurd, and did this study because of that.

“1) We found that irrationality, far from being what IQ tests miss, is one of the best IQ tests available. 2) We found that irrationality, far from being unrelated to genetics and more of a mindset, is among the most heritable of psychological traits. 3) Irrationality is making mistakes which are unnecessary: wrong decisions when we have all the information we need, and some simple logic means there is no reason for the error. We found that realizing what information is available, and applying some simple logic, is almost all of the cause of cognitive irrationality. 4) Cognitive ability explained nearly all of cognitive irrationality, and much of the overlap was genetic.”

[u/AidosKynee → u/Sinai]

I'm always skeptical of solo authors, particularly when the study is inflammatory. Apparently this author is on the editorial board of the journal, which is also a concern.

[u/Sinai → u/AidosKynee]

This is about as far from inflammatory a study as you can get. This is a orthodox scientist with thousands of citations in the field arriving at the orthodox conclusion.

[u/AidosKynee → u/Sinai]

"Genetics causes bad behavior" is definitely treading a dangerous line, which Intelligence has been known to step over.

That's why I'm wary when it's a solo author doing the study, and one who's got a strong "in" with the journal. It's far too easy for one person's preconceptions to taint their research, and you pointed out that they were unable to even appear unbiased.

I'm not a psychologist, so I won't comment on the merits of the study itself. I'll leave it up to their field to replicate these findings or not.

[u/[deleted] → u/AidosKynee]

People like to pretend we are the one animal not behaviorally influenced by our genetics but we are, we know behavior traits can be selected for in various species the problem is a matter of a choice and we as a people need to choose not to engage in legally enforced Eugenics in people while still acknowledging reality that we don't know what we don't know and allowing research to proceed so we can perhaps still find treatments for problematic behaviors that may have a genetic or epigenetic component.

[u/Foolishium → u/[deleted]]

Ok, how we categorize "Problematic" behavior? Is "Autism" problematic behavior? Is "Schizoid" a problematic behavior? Is "Narcissicsm" a problematic behavior?

To even entertain behavioral genetic engineering to cure "problematic" behavior is more problematic than those "problematic" behavior themselves.

[u/[deleted] → u/Foolishium]

Generally that goes through medical boards and studies but yes people would like to be able to treat various mental disorders. Autism non functioning low function would be nice if it could be cured and allow people to live a normal full life not dependent on others for everything instead of being able to make their own choices. High level obviously doesn't matter they have autonomy friends in the spectrum. It would have been great if there was a better treatment for schizophrenia so an old friend of mine wouldn't have lost it and murdered his mother. That line you speak of is and always will exist but isn't a reason not to do the research. Is a reason for robust regulation of application of said knowledge. What do we allow testing for prior to birth and what are parents allowed to do with that information is a valid conversation, are we allowed to gain that understanding of knowledge and restricting even finding out is not a useful discussion in my opinion and only delays putting in proper safe guards.

[u/Arashmickey → u/[deleted]]

proper safe guards.

What are the political and social and political safeguards? How do we know if they're effective?

Given how the idea of genetic intelligence has fed slavery and war, I should to find expect slippery slope arguments and resistance in the comment section here.

The need for safeguard should have been apparent before this study, and it should be apparent now.

And although I'd like to be a vocal proponent for research in this matter, I'm given pause by the absence of discussion of effective safeguards here, where it's relevant.