First time? This has literally been the model for the series since the beginning. The only times it hasn't played out this way were times that the West didn't receive a base game (Dos, MH4, etc.) and only got the MR expansion version (FU, 4U, etc.). Or the reverse in the case of MH G back in Gen 1.
Just FYI, they did release the base game Freedom 2 before Freedom Unite in the west. Confusing because it isn't Freedom 2 Unite, so you'd just have to know.
For what I know dos is technically the base game, but that never released in the US. And freedom/unite is slightly different as it's a new village and I at least believe the rid of the season mechanics(although I can't say I remember as it's been like 15 years since I played it)
Yeah Freedom 2 and Dos are pretty much completely unrelated, the number if anything only matches up with the generation. It's sorta similar to Portable 3rd vs Tri/3U.
I guess Freedom 2 would be the base game cause it was portable yeah... I was thinking of Dos as the base game but I'm fuzzy on that whole thing. I'm getting old plus it's the generation I've played the least because you can miss me with the claw grip on PSP. Ah well, point still stands I think!
lol, I bounced completely off of FU. It was my first MH technically but I don’t count it for obvious reasons, I got a few hours in, my hands were utterly destroyed, and I was like “…ok, not for me”. Plus I needed to sell my PSP for food money. It took me until 4U to FINALLY get into the series for real because I could play it without misery and pain.
Well, it has very little in common with MH2 really, where the main mechanics are day night cycles and seasonal changes. Hell Dos even has PVP. Freedom 2 is a different village with a different story and different mechanics. The only similarity really is that they're both numbered 2.
Like comparing Portable 3rd and Tri, they're completely different games with wholly different mechanics even if they both have a 3 in the name.
there are reviewers new to the series with 80 hours on the game who havent failed a single quest. saying he "waltzed through every quest"
yes, the high difficulty hunts are in the G rank expansions but idk why so many people are lying to themselves saying you could sleepwalk through every single base game. thats just not true
It probably took me 7+ attempts to take down barroth for the first time in Tri, but that might've just been because I was bad (and trying to use a lance).
You Also carted to dumb shit in old games. Insta sprints, turn arounds, etc
In my experience most carts in previous titles were due to the clunkiness. Adding windups and tells to everything while Also giving people more options in movement Will inevitably make the game easier, But also more fair.
I'm pretty sure I had to swap to hammer to actually beat it (the flowery shock one iirc), but then one of the guys I started playing with was a 100% hammer-only main. So I've been a Greatsword enjoyer ever since.
iirc barroth in tri comes at an awkward time in the weapon tree where you only have access to weapons of lower sharpness. I forget if lance has innately improved penetration in that game. Even if it does, your damage won't be huge on a mobile monster if you're new to the game. Can you block the charge or do you need guard+? You don't exactly have a good lance set by then either...again, iirc.
Exactly, sub is lying to themselves over slight cristism towards the game. Spoiler alert the games good to great as always we dont have to be dishonest to prop it up
It's hard to trust reviewers when you don't even know specifics about them or their experience though. I find it hard to believe people skated through everything including arkveld as a new player without eating shit first. And who really cares if the early game is hard since the difficulty is amped for tempered and other stuff like that in endgame.
Except it's NOT "amped" for tempered and other stuff in endgame. The whole thing stays easy, gets even easier too. Like, it's backwards progression for some reason. There's definitely a massive issue with the endgame and high rank. It feels easier than low rank in world did, that's crazy to me.
World was my first Monster hunter and I was stuck on Anjananth for a month and prolly took me 2-3 weeks to beat nergigante. 🤷🏽♂️ obviously future play throughs I skated through them but It wasn’t smooth sailing for a while xD.
Saaaaaame. Anjanath was a very clear brick wall in difficulty for me. Died like 20 times (all solo). Got the hang of the game then hit another wall with Odogaron (not as bad). Kept occasionally running into monsters that would stymie me for awhile until Nergigante, who proceeded to defeat me 30+ times even with SOS. World was not the cake walk many people might make it out to be if it was your first entry.
That is largely what MH is right there. It will only ever be as difficult as your 1st game. Every entry after or going back to an older one will never be as hard.
When I went through World at launch (after already putting hours into Tri, 3U, 4U, GU and Online), it was largely easy and didnt cart much at all.
Wasnt till Nergi and maybe Teo that I was given any real good push back.
Only time I struggled was the TU monsters and some tempereds.
Also went back to FU for the 1st time over a year ago.
Tigrex and Kushala were very easy to cheese and I didnt feel any real challenge till high rank.
cool. now beat arch tempered nergigante
(yes, I know, he isn't technically avaliable on release but saying that base world had no difficult hunts whatsoever is ridiculous, if you really need other examples just do some other tempered elders I guess).
As someone that started with the first; it's absolutely true. The games have never been hard, ever. The skill ceiling isn't about fighting hard enemies, it's about how much you can style on them.
In my opinion the older games where only hard because the controls where fucked up. Like on DS or PsP, PS2, WiiU the controls where horrific. World and Rise have far better and more logical controls, i don't have to hold two random buttons just to move the camera, and then use the joystick to swing the fucking sword.
I cannot stress enough how stupid the controls where and it makes sense people think World, Rise and Wilds is easier as the controls actually make sense.
My recollection of world was basically sleepwalking through everything until I hit a wall monster, then sleepwalking through everything until I hit the next wall monster.
I'm older now with more responsibilities, so I'm just going to hit HR here now, but I think the biggest challenge with difficulty perception right now is that each apex should have been a wall, but kinda really wasn't. LR needed at least one or two wall monsters to at least compel some minor level of 'go out and upgrade your stuff.'
Also just throwing 100 armor spheres at people as a 'starting gift' was a mistake.
Sure, that's true. But whether I agree depends on what exactly you're talking about. Do you have a problem with the base games being too easy, or with the base game -> expansion release model itself? If it's the former, sure, I think building a bit more difficulty into the HR endgame would probably be a good thing. But if you don't like the base game -> expansion model itself, I can't agree with that. That system works really well for a series like Monster Hunter.
I think a game should provide some level of pushback on launch. You shouldn't be able to steamroll the entire experience with absolutely zero challenge on day one. I'm not asking for super hard monsters or anything, I'm asking for them to be a threat, AT ALL. Even in World, when I started my new save file to replay it a few months ago, there are still a few monsters in the base game that that still threaten me, if I'm lazy.
if what multiple reviewers are saying is true, and they were at no point threatened with being carded at any point in the game, that is a massive, massive flaw. monster Hunter isn't supposed to hold your hand from game start to credits. I don't want to play a version of this series where I can turn my brain off for the entire experience and still come out on top.
I mean I 100% agree that if you aren't even at threat of being carted at any time, that's a big problem. I just can't believe that's actually the case. I played the beta, both Arkveld and Rey Dau were absolutely capable of carting me if I played lazy (and in the case of Arkveld, even if I didn't).
Even if beta Arkveld is harder than anything in the game at launch (entirely possible), I just can't see a world where you can just turn your brain off and faceroll a solo tempered Rey Dau (or insert whichever apex-level monster here) without carting once. That doesn't sound realistic to me.
So I personally am not super worried, especially given the very positive reviews from people I trust like Peppo, SDShephard, etc. People who have been playing the series a long time and are really good at it. I also trust the Monster Hunter team, they've earned that trust over the last 20 years. If it's a disaster, then I'll reevaluate, but right now all the concern just sounds like an echo-chamber amplification effect to me.
I mean I 100% agree that if you aren't even at threat of being carted at any time, that's a big problem. I just can't believe that's actually the case. I played the beta, both Arkveld and Rey Dau were absolutely capable of carting me if I played lazy (and in the case of Arkveld, even if I didn't).
The problem Im having rn is that these reviews dont match the experience we got from the beta
The only reason the beta monsters were a threat was 1. They have been confirmed to have been beefed up from their base game stats for the beta and 2. You were stuck with absolutely terrible equipment that is likely far worse than what you'll have access to in the full game. If you go against Black Diablos in World with Jagras weapons and no armor spheres spent you'll struggle too. Not really an indicator of anything.
Now, I should be clear, I'm not that worried that you'll be able to completely steamroll the game, but if there aren't multiple monsters that are fully capable of causing me to fail a quest on the first couple tries with completely up to par armor, I will consider that a fundamental failure of game design, and that sounds like it is the case. We'll have to wait and see to be sure, but I'm not confident.
fully capable of causing me to fail a quest on the first couple tries with completely up to par armor
All things considered, if you're struggling against monsters when you have gear that's meant to be able to be used against them, you've probably got more of a skill issue than a "monster difficulty" issue.
I dunno, there just doesn't seem to be compelling supporting evidence for that. But it's also really subjective, what's acceptable difficulty for me may not be the case for you. We'll know in a few days anyways!
See the 74+ reviews many mentioning it the easy difficulty, many being first timers even. There is quite literally a plethora of evidence the game is easy.
Of course it's easy, there's a big difference between "most of the content is easy" and "literally nothing in the game can cart you and you are never threatened ever" which is what the other guy is claiming to be worried about.
Every LR/HR game in the last 10 years of the series has had most of the content be easy, that's not a problem for me. If you're a series vet, LR/HR games are essentially glorified demos for the MR expansion. That is not a new phenomenon.
if what multiple reviewers are saying is true, and they were at no point threatened with being carded at any point in the game, that is a massive, massive flaw. monster Hunter isn't supposed to hold your hand from game start to credits. I don't want to play a version of this series where I can turn my brain off for the entire experience and still come out on top.
A lot of people seem to be mistaking that your average player is far worse than what the average poster in this forum appears to be from a skill perspective, they will be carting multiple times or outright hitting walls against what many people consider basic easy monsters. Even reviewers themselves are going to generally be better equipped than the average player and many saying they felt no pressure doesn't really immediately scream red flag to me.
I guarantee you there will be multiple people with negative reviews on steam within the first few hours that the game is too difficult and needs to be far easier.
A lot of people seem to be mistaking that your average player is far worse than what the average poster in this forum appears to be from a skill perspective
Tbh idk where anyone gets that these games are easy. Personally I still get in trouble a lot and even cart once or twice sometimes on quests. This is base World and Rise I'm speaking of and at this point idk if it's because people play these games too much or I don't play them enough anymore.
If you want it to be harder, play challenge runs, like no-upgrade base weapons. 🤷♂️ MH doesn't have a scaling level system, it can be as easy or as hard as you want it to be.
Entirely ruins the entire point of Monster Hunter. The POINT of Monster Hunter is building sets that compliment your weapon to help you overcome hurdles of tougher monsters. That's... LITERALLY the entire purpose of the series since the very first game. Building a good set and using it to increase my chances against a hard monster has been the DRIVING factor for Monster Hunter, always. Challenge runs take away all the fun out of that loop. Not a good suggestion at all
What are you categorizing as "Too easy" though... If the point is to have a set that makes a hunt easier, you aren't allowed to complain that having that set makes the hunt "Too Easy".
"too easy" means "I was never particularly worried about carting even a single time". Even in world, my semi-optimized sets still felt like i COULD cart in high rank against some of the more aggressive, high damage monsters.
Okay? So what's your evidence that Wilds, a game that isn't even out yet, doesn't also have specific aggressive, high damage monsters that fill that role? (Also, out of curiosity, which monsters are you referring to? Were they release, or Post-Release monsters?)
If the point is to have a set that makes a hunt easier, you aren't allowed to complain that having that set makes the hunt "Too Easy".
Part of the appeal of the Monster Hunter loop is the sense of progression--where the reward of getting better gear from hunts results in the feeling of your hunter getting stronger. There is an ideal balance point with the difficulty where gear upgrades feel like they have a tangible effect on the difficulty of hunts, such that the new weapon or armor you got from beating a difficult hunt means that hunt isn't so difficult the next time.
If the game is too easy at baseline, that diminishes the sense of progression you get from improving weapons and armor--because in general, it is much more noticeable to players when upgrades make a hard fight easier than it is if the fight was already easy and becomes even easier. If you have to handicap yourself to not use better weapons and armor to get a challenge, that also removes that progression. Not everyone wants the games to be difficult, but being difficult enough for progressive gear upgrades feel impactful is fundamental to the core gameplay loop that underpins the series. Fights have to be difficult enough for upgrades to feel like they matter.
That's a fair premise to operate within, however I feel like there's not enough context around what is making the game "Too Easy". Like, a few reviews I read mentioned the NPC's being overpowered, or the Focus Moves trivializing fights, but both of those systems can theoretically be ignored to increase the impact of equipment loadouts if that's the experience you're aiming for.
We also don't have much information or hands-on experience about or with post-game/release and expansion monsters, which are typically where the difficulty spikes for veteran players. (Even in Worlds, Xeno'Jiva wasn't really considered a difficult fight compared to what came later.)
Too easy, is like the defender armor/weapons in base world. Using any other armor you would have access to, makes the game slightly easier depending on your build. Defender, makes everything way too easy and is meant to catapult you to iceborn content. So far, wilds feels like your default setup is defender Armour and weapons, and no way to remove them. It's bad
I want to tackle the really fun tough end game content with friends, it’s hard to keep them around when 4 manning base high rank is a snooze fest. It happened in worlds, it happened in rise, my friends all play and then 6-12 months later I’m SOSing into pug lobbies with insta-cart jp players and my option is to push through this hell (which I do) or solo end game
Do you want the game to get delayed by a year and have an even higher price tag with all the new content they had to add? I'm confused on what exactly yall want. Do you want the base game( which reviewers said was like 40 hours with all the side missions) and the 40 hour DLC like IB to just be one 80 hour experience for the low price of $70?
Do you want the game to get delayed by a year and have an even higher price tag with all the new content they had to add? I'm confused on what exactly yall want. Do you want the base game( which reviewers said was like 40 hours with all the side missions) and the 40 hour DLC like IB to just be one 80 hour experience for the low price of $70?
No, I never said that. You made that up.
They can just develop the game with a proper learning curve and scaling challenges in it, like every other developer does. You could do that with the same monsters the game will already come out with.
I dunno, it isn't the perfect system but it's better than running a series into the ground chasing the largest demographic possible. It also lets the game have a really really wide skill level appeal.
Character vouchers are crazy to me. The ability to change a character exists in the game already, yet you are supposed to pay for it. It's reminds me of the CEO that wanted gamers to pay for ammo in shooters. Granted that is an even worse decision than character vouchers, but I get similar vibes.
You guys say as if just having a harder quests or more tuned monsters as an option after you end the main quest is going to alienate most people, that isnt even possible
The only reason you're playing MH right now is because Tri made the series easier to appeal to a wider audience. If Tri failed Capcom was gonna scrap MH.
You can go on old Tri forums and type in the word "easy" into the search bar and you'll find a bunch of whine posts talking about how it took skill out of the game to appeal to a larger demographic
Just to be clear, Freedom Unite is not the MR expansion of Dos. Dos never got an MR expansion, instead it went straight to the next portable team game which released as Freedom 2 in the West. Similar to how Portable 3rd never got an MR expansion and instead the series went straight back to the console team with 3U and 4.
It's not just that but so much skill carries over between games like of course it'll be easier than previous ones unless they keep making them harder. After seeing arkveld and knowing previous monsters I don't expect it to stray that far off
Yeah, I kind of miss the old ways when Japan got the base game and everywhere else only got the ultimate version a year later.
It's just not as enjoyable for my instant gratification ass, and I know that after I do everything I want with base game I probably won't pick it up until the dlc and then need to take off the rust...
ikr i dont get people it has always been insanely easy to play through low and high rank and G-Rank (Masterrank) has been the challenging content . It has always been like this safe for Generations where even G-Rank was easy side from the Deviants and Hypers.
Freedom 2 is harder to progress in than Freedom Unite. FU added lots of QOL features which make the game feel a lot easier, the monsters tend to die faster, and the controls in FU are a lot more responsive making evasion easier. By the time you get to G rank in FU, you can can make way better armor sets that stack evade+2 with big damage boosts, so playing through high rank F2 solo without all of that stuff is generally more difficult.
World wasn't so easy that you could go through all the vanilla carting while carting just 2x. The whole loot and mastery aspect of weapons is a waste of time if its too easy.
World, was that easy, though? I think I failed the nergi quest once (and I full blame that on the weird hit box of his dive) but that's it until post game.
No, before world, the ultimate version of each monster hunter game (the base game + DLC) had the monsters in its’ corresponding quests have less hp than their non ultimate (the base game) counterparts. World started the trend of the base game being easy while the DLC being harder, Rise continued it, and Wilds will seem to continue this trend as well.
I believe the purpose of that was to make it easier for players to reach new content, which made sense at a time when expansion sized DLC content either didn’t exist (back with MH Freedom), was perhaps too new to implement (MH Tri) or the consoles’ hardware couldn’t handle it (MH4).
That being said, World was not “easy,”returning players have just gotten better at playing the MH series over time, and this is true for nearly every game in the MH series.
If you go back to before Iceborn was even announced, people were struggling with and complaining over how difficult HR Nergigante was, as well as a number of other monsters like Kirin and Kushala Daora. If the game were truly easy on release then this vid by NHCP probably wouldn’t exist lol
There was someone like 2 weeks ago complaining about HR nergi and was talking about quitting the game if he couldn’t get help. People new to mh it is hard. Anyone retuning to wilds it is easy. Same as Dark souls games. They just get easier the more of them you play.
The difficulty absolutely has dropped. Games been out for a minute now, and it's spreading like the plague. It clearly is an issue at this point. Making up excuses isn't cutting it anymore.
So low rank was relatively easy for returning hunters? Imagine my surprise.
Now that people have actually gotten into high rank allot of them are starting to struggle with the difficulty increase and even returning hunters are carting, exactly like with World.
Some of you guys jump the gun so fast on these things.
Theres some difficulty spikes like Nergigante and the last two fights, but apart from that, World is definitely easier than previous titles. Its a combination of the player being much stronger in relation to the Monster and being able to afford good gear earlier for less investment. Even then, the last two fights are hard because of the 30min timer on Fat and the elemental DPS check on Alatreon.
I mean, start up the game and drink a potion while running. 95% of Monsters wont ever hit you. That mechanic alone makes it so much easier, that only AOE spamming monsters become a threat.
When the game first dropped a lot of people had a hard time against anjanath in low rank. Not saying it’s not easy but everyone playing monster hunter for the first time being world it wasn’t really easy for them. And they have added some quality of life improvements for sure and plus the controls and aiming just makes it easier. Like not having to track a monster with a paintball makes it easier but that’s something that makes it better at the same time.
Yes, but I dont know why you would gaslight people into acting like LR didnt get easier. It was never hard if you were a veteran, but it wasnt a mindless slaughter either. I still play many older games from time to time, World had by far the easiest low rank and Wilds seem to be even easier.
> And they have added some quality of life improvements
Those arent QOL improvements, these things are massive gameplay changes. Do you think that they didnt have the technology to make a running while drinking potion animation back then? It was a concious decision. The hunter had a lot of openings to exploit and so did the Monster, it was a matter of timing on both sides of the fight.
You may not like that, but the implication for the difficulty curve of World was that the fights in lategame were dominated by AOE spamming (cause u count run/heal from that) or mechanics like EJ and the 30min fatalis timer, while everything else is easy. Theres basically no openings on the players side in Wilds. The player - monster balance seems to be completely one sided.
> Like not having to track a monster with a paintball makes it easier but that’s something that makes it better at the same time.
Thats a matter of taste and removing the tracking part of a hunting game is not just a QOL change either. Paintballs arent ideal, but no tracking at all makes the whole theme a facade. May aswell put the monster in an arena and call it a day.
don't know man, got my ass handed on elden ring. Not as bad as my first souls, but still died a lot.
Have been replaying mh4u, and high rank is not exactly a joke. Limited resources in a hunt and monsters deal quite some dmg , I had to upgrade the armor to not go insane.
While in world, I managed to do a no armor upgrade run without major problems (up to killing fatalis).
Don't even can understand how someone can argue the series didn't get easier from world onwards.
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u/AttackBacon Feb 24 '25
First time? This has literally been the model for the series since the beginning. The only times it hasn't played out this way were times that the West didn't receive a base game (Dos, MH4, etc.) and only got the MR expansion version (FU, 4U, etc.). Or the reverse in the case of MH G back in Gen 1.