r/MonsterHunter • u/Regular_Season4865 • 28d ago
MH Wilds Dear devs, PLEASE stop giving Lance the draw skills lmao
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u/Everlast17 28d ago
T8 Poison Gypceros Gunlance has it and it makes me so sad. It’s my favourite weapon.
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u/rider5001 28d ago
It really is mind boggling that someone thought it was a good idea
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u/Watts121 28d ago
Honestly this is what’s gonna control the meta going forward. The moment new weapons drop with shit like built in Crit Boost it’ll change things. It’s honestly the only way to beat Arti Weapons at this point since they let them have natural white regardless of bonus.
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u/Grix1s If it hops, it drops. 28d ago
Aye the Rathalos LS comes with, and its undoubtedly one of the best cause of it.
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u/wdtfs3 Jack of all trades 28d ago edited 28d ago
it's not a bad skill, but it only works on a few weapons like LS and GS. actually pretty much only them edit: spelling cuz autocorrect is stupid
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u/jr111192 28d ago
I can see why crit boost is bad on GS, but why isn't it good on LS?
That's the one weapon I've never mained, so I might be missing something obvious.
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u/wdtfs3 Jack of all trades 28d ago
imma be real I misread that as crit draw. as long as you have good crit crit boost is good on anything
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u/jr111192 28d ago
Oh gotcha! That makes sense, I only used the draw skills on GS, and if they work with that unsheathe attack LS uses, then I can see how they'd be strong on LS too.
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u/Slickrickx17 28d ago
Crit Draw does work with Longsword's sheathing (R2+X)/(RT+A) attacks.
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u/yurilnw123 28d ago
More like they have to put a skill there but don't want certain weapons to be strong so they put a useless skill.
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u/R0CKETRACER 28d ago
Certain trees have the same skill on all weapons. Rath had Critboost for example.
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u/Mar_Kell 28d ago
Yep, my same reaction. I can understand that it looks like something that does impact damage and they wanted to give it skill with such theme, but makes no sense gameplay-wise.
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u/TheCultofJanus 28d ago
You should see how many Duel Blades have draw skills on then 😢
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u/ElfRespecter 28d ago
I honestly knew this would happen the second I saw skills would be tied to weapons, because it requires Capcom to actually know the weapons. Like, Dual Blades with crit draw...what?
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u/kyuuri117 28d ago
Yea there are just questionable decisions everywhere. Like what is the point of designing beautiful looking weapons across the board and then having the artian weapons just be best in slot?
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u/DinnerWinner 28d ago
I just can't bring myself to use the artian weapons. They look so uninspiring compared to any of the monster ones. Honestly, I don't even care if I'm sacrificing 10 or 20 percent damage it's not like the hunts take that long anyway
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u/Leorake 28d ago
Last I checked the math (on sns) was ~7% on a perfect artian. So you're not missing much.
I feel they should have saved this for the wilds version of safi/kulve/fatalis/alatreon or whatever.
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u/1kingdomheart 28d ago
Looking on the upside, at least whatever we get later is bound to be better. Either they'll be reworked or we get something else.
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u/Bacon-muffin 28d ago
They're clearly basing it on the monsters and not on the weapon type.
They already struggled to balance weapons in the first place to the point where most weapons weren't usable and served no purpose in existing beyond layered appearances... not sure why they thought adding skills to the weapons to further exacerbate this problem was a good idea.
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u/Username928351 28d ago
Things like these make me wonder sometimes if they even play their own games.
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u/DrMobius0 28d ago
I think half of it is that the designers really just want to force you to try something stupid.
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u/Reload86 28d ago
I can’t remember without looking but I swear there was also a bow with critical draw on it. I could be wrong though, I was mostly irritated with a lot of the poorly thought out skills thrown onto the weapons.
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u/douglasduck104 28d ago
Crit Draw dragon piercer bow was actually quite a fun playstyle in World...
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u/DrMobius0 28d ago
That at least has a niche, weird as it is. Bow can hold its charge directly out of a draw and fire off whatever it wants as a draw attack, including dragon piercer.
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u/BloodGulchBlues37 28d ago
At least for my feeling on a lot of these CritDraw weapons is they wanted them to exist for ledge abusers.
CritDraw changed in Wilds to not just be the first hit, but for a duration after unsheathing, meaning you can do things like unsheathe hammer charge and it apply on the full attack, unsheathe off a ledge using demon mode and go into heavenly blade dance, etc.
I don't think it's particularly good minus some really specific optimization or meme playstyles, but we also have no idea what's coming maybe there will be a Valor mode mantle or something in the expac
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u/8bitzombi 28d ago edited 28d ago
Honestly, it wouldn’t be too bad if lance could draw directly into their focus attack and the entire attack was covered by Crit Draw including the wound break.
It would be situational, but along with Flayer and Partbreaker it could be useful.
However, the devs seem to really hate the prospect of giving players options for draw attacks and refuse to let most weapons draw into anything but a neutral triangle…
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u/Informal-Reach1165 28d ago
So, it's entirely situational but, in theory, shouldn't the skill trigger if you were to not dismount attack but just hop off the seikret and manually do one of the air attacks? Cause you can do the jump slam as a draw attack with the gunlance. It'd be highly situational and there's def more viable offensive skills but I see how it could potentially be abused with quick sheath slotted in
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u/8bitzombi 28d ago
Yeah, Crit Draw covers aerial draw attacks while either leaping from the seikret or off a ledge as well.
I don’t play enough lance or GL to be able to judge whether that would be useful enough to warrant having the skill though, especially with how valuable weapon skills are due to their limited availability.
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u/Informal-Reach1165 28d ago
Oh the viability isn't high lmao. Itd be more of a fun/gimmick build more than anything, unless the crit draw last a couple seconds. If it does have an activation window, the jump slam with GL does chain into the full burst stake move so it could benefit at least that first stake. Definitely more of a gimmick. Idk that Lance has anything like that tho either
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u/GeneralGom 28d ago
It's unfortunate, since those are some cool looking lances.
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u/Difficult-Pick4048 28d ago
There will eventually be layered weapons again I am very certain.
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u/tekman526 28d ago
With artian weapons being the thing they obviously want to railroad everyone to I will be in complete awe if we don't get layered weapons in a title update.
Otherwise, the endgame of base wilds will have LITERALLY EVERY SINGLE WEAPON using the same exact thing that looks the exact same.
What's even weirder is that they made it a point to say that there were no more slap on weapons and everything is unique just to make all of those unique weapons objectively inferior to artian weapons which in a way other than being an endgame system is actually worse than slap on weapons because now, for example all elemental dual blades look literally the exact same
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u/Ketheres Discombobulate 28d ago
The question is whether we'll get it in a TU or in the eventual expansion.
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u/Difficult-Pick4048 28d ago
They seem to be making layered equipment available earlier with each game. We now have layered armor right off the bat as soon as we hit high rank. If I am not mistaken layered equipment came to World with Iceborne and Rise had layered armor and layered Rampage weapons in a title update.
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u/QUEBBEC 28d ago
Fucking sucks that they werent included on launch tho. Hopefully we wont have to wait till the expansion to get them.
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u/Bubul64 28d ago
Please give offensive guard to more lance please
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u/Similar-Yogurt6271 28d ago
Okay Sword and Shield it is!
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u/0ppositeTrash Let go your earthly tether 28d ago
Ok fair, but also OG on SnS is actually really cracked and I love it. The guard animation is so fast you can just guard everything for almost 100% OG uptime.
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u/DemonLordSparda 28d ago
I think offensive guard is probably best on SnS as well as Lance. They can really crank out damage in that 12 second window.
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u/th5virtuos0 28d ago
That’s why the Monkey Fist is really strong. Solid sharpness, OG3, solid blast and solid raw. A good all rounder for literally everything
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u/WyrdHarper 28d ago
OG is pretty solid on SnS this time around—it’s pretty easy to have 100% uptime.
We also get some draw perks on weapons. Maybe a little more useful since SnS does sheath and run to reposition sometimes, but it’s still just a buff on a weak attack.
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u/NickygUrl 28d ago
Skills on weapons wasn't a good idea, can't convince me otherwise
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u/ITNODove 28d ago
I agree completely. I see why they went this route, but I greatly preferred the precious skill system.
Not to mention the removal of gun recoil and reload skills entirely...
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u/Lazyade 28d ago
Not being able to adjust recoil or reload on bowguns is so ass. Is spread even good anymore now that shooting it invariably locks you for ages? Just seems like taking away options and versatility.
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u/PooPooKazew 28d ago
Honestly Capcom ruined bowguns for me with that. Every single water based gun has to use spread for some reason so when I'm out of water ammo it's basically useless
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u/DanielTeague power bugs > speed bugs 28d ago
Then you're out of Water Ammo even more often because the farm still has 0 Flowfern after 10 hunts. I miss being able to set my farm to "give me ammo of all kinds" and coming back from a single hunt to a bounty of herbs and berries.
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u/greencurtains2 28d ago
I think having skills on weapons is fine. The problem is that a lot of the most important skills in the game can no longer be acquired from armour (or even armour decorations). On a skill-hungry weapon like Lance, this means you either need a weapon with max slots (currently only artian) or a weapon that comes with one of your essential skills already. When I got to endgame, I browsed the top-end weapons and there are actually only a couple that have a good Lance skill and white sharpness.
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u/Ashencroix 28d ago
At least make them universally useful skills for that weapon, like crit eye or atk up.
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u/Commercial-Piano6476 28d ago
That'd be kinda silly they might as well increase the base attack or affinity of the weapon
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u/NickygUrl 28d ago
I agree with that. But it's still weird to have different skills. For example, when switching elemental types, one switchaxe will have focus and the other has critical element and masters touch. Just feels weird. Kinda forces you into specific skills regardless. Which most of the type is fine, but critical draw on Lance? that's bizarre
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u/Ashencroix 28d ago
The only time I think it might be a shred of use for a lance is whenever I do a sneak attack. And that's at most twice per monster.
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u/AtlasExiled 28d ago
I agree, I'm not really a big fan of the direction they're taking decorations where you can only put offensive decos on weapons. I feel like all that does is take reduce your options for build diversity. I understand that a lot of late game builds looked the same ie crit eye, weakness exploit, attack boost, etc. but I don't think that this is a good solution. It feels like there is way less armor that is actually good in the game because they're mostly flooded with these non-offense skills. This is one of the main reasons why almost everyone just goes for the arkveld armor sets for the weakness exploit. This is also why the artian weapons are most of the best weapons in the game because they can fit the most lvl 3 offensive decos. I'm glad there is a weapon crafting system that is tied to tempered monsters, this game really gives an incentive to go and do tempered monsters compared to previous titles. I don't think the best weapons should be almost completely tied to decoration slots. It power creeps the rest of the cooler weapons.
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u/Stryde_ 28d ago
Like 60% of IGs weapons are draw or charge skills. Literally useless, really quite disappointed in the IG on Wilds.
Don't much like the skills being tied to weapons in general to be honest
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u/Rhyav 28d ago
I don't want "base skills" tied to weapons, but monster-unique skills as a bonus to weapons would be really awesome! Example: Rathalos' Flare skill being tied to Rathalos weapons instead of its armor set. It'd add so much identity to the monster weapons too!
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u/tekman526 28d ago
This is what I was really hoping for with this system. Having certain weapons that are the best in slot for specific builds. Heck, keep the armor set bonus, but make a super strong 3rd level that you can get from using the weapon as well or something.
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u/Loubar15 28d ago edited 28d ago
But charge skills are amazing on IG tho, the strong descending slash (offset that leads into spiral slash) gets enhanced through charge master and focus makes it charge up faster (sure, focus is not all that great anyways). I definitely agree with your take on weapon locked skills but IG is definitely not a bad one, only the crit draw skill weapons are useless
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u/After_Gene_5689 28d ago
I have 100 hours only IG in Wilds til now and I skipped crit draw, charge master, focus, power prolonger IG because
- Crit draw is useless; sheathing IG takes a full business day
- Charge master only boosts ~4% in my testing, maybe it's bugged as it does nothing for bow as well.
- Focus 3 makes no sense because it does not break the 2 light attacks 1 strong descending slash interval. Maybe the only usage is to charge faster for the panic offset
- Power prolonger you only want to use if you don't RSS the WHOLE fight which means fighting against Balahara, Chatacabra. Still, the number of wounds you can create is just too many you don't even need to worry about extracts
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u/Loubar15 28d ago
Ah well I stand corrected then, thanks for the details, i'll have to redo all my builds then bcs i'm pretty sure i've slotted in charge master in quite a few of them lmao What do you recommend as far as weapons/skills to slot in for IG? I Guess you went for artian weapons?
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u/freariose 28d ago
The split skill system has many problems, but IG is the strongest it's ever been for a good long while.
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u/Stryde_ 28d ago
Yeah strong forsure, but I didn't much enjoy the spam the charged extract release thing. It's so quick to get extracts now which is cool I guess, but that also means you're likely to spend them pretty quickly.
I guess I've just never really found ground IG engaging, and I get they wanted to move away from fighter pilots and helicopters, but overfull just feels a lot less enjoyable than rise.
Wyvern dive will always be something I'll miss sadly.
Am enjoying LS though, still kind of helm break spammy, but nice qol and dynamic play otherwise
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u/yurilnw123 28d ago
Fully agreed with this take. Also they made IG too button intensive this time. Using a controller, it's literally impossible to dodge/vault while hold O to charge and attacking with Triangle unless you grow fingers on your right hand. All the while you have to adjust the camera with R stick because IG forces you to be in focus mode all the time. Idk who came up with this button layout iteration for IG it's pretty dumb. We don't need 2 aiming button (L2 and R2) just combine them (let us aim kinsect with L2, why did they move it to R2 to begin with??) then move the current O charge to R2. That alone would fix many things. Holding R2 > X to vault > Release R2 to descending thrust would be smooth af. Currently it just feel clunky all around.
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u/pierre_pierre 28d ago
Hell, with the ability to get extracts from Focus Mode and Wounds they could even get rid of Kinsect aiming entirely. I bet they didn't want to alter the weapon too much to not upset returning players. Which already happened in the Beta, regarding Aerials. So we get this weird half-half solution with redundant mechanics.
At least the DPS on the RSS loop is nice ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Meanwhile I started using SnS and, oh boy, do I wish IG felt this fluid.
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u/Nathan936639 28d ago
Same as Dualblades and Chargeblade, they have crit draw.
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u/wewz_1 28d ago
Insect Glaives got a lot of Power Prolonger which is kind of useless after they changed IG's gameplay.
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u/After_Gene_5689 28d ago
just delete this trash skill it's so niche to the point only LS and GS use it, now LS doesn't even use it and GS doesn't even have a set for it
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u/iHaku GS Legend 28d ago
i dont even know why they didnt just put the crit draw as an inherent part of the draw attacks for those weapons by now, instead of having them be skills. it'd just make so much sense
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u/OlafWoodcarver 28d ago
Because you could say that about Rapid Morph, Load Shells, Offensive Guard, and a ton of other skills that are only used by 1-2 weapons.
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u/Iroiroanswer 28d ago
I use it against Gore Magala though. The draw attack has enough time for a full charge slash then a half charge strong charge slash.
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u/XFalzar Long Sword Pleb 28d ago
not even LS and GS use them all that much. LS only does it on iai spirit+spirit release slash spam builds and while that is a viable play style, it isn't as strong as just maintaining red gauge and spamming spirit blade (I know it's called crimson slash, I don't care). Meanwhile GS gets a lot of its damage from TCS and Strong Charged slash, which can't benefit from this. Crit Draw GS hasn't been meta since gen 4.
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u/8bitzombi 28d ago edited 28d ago
Crit Draw GS is in an ok place, still not as good as it was prior to World but not too bad; and it’s still quite a bit easier to build for than a Crit TCS.
For example using Poison King with Crit Draw 3, Crit Boost 3 and Punishing Draw 2 a full charge draw slash crits for 500 while a non crit TCS hits for 550 on the training dummy.
It’s less damage, but it’s consistent damage and it allows you to basically run whatever you want for armor.
If you went for a 100% Crit TCS build you’d definitely be able to do a lot more overall damage but it would require you to pretty much devote most if not your whole set to hitting 100% affinity and you’d be giving up some really great offensive and defensive skills in the process.
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u/PowerSamurai 28d ago
Sometimes it's not about meta but being able to use your own playstyle at a viable level. People obsessed with meta is OK but that does not mean that should be the default attitude to how to play these games.
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u/TheWaterCloset 28d ago
i'm pretty sure draw slash and strong charge slash got buffed quite a bit and TCS was nerfed due to the easy Focus Strike into TCS loop, so crit draw is actually pretty good on GS right now.
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u/LuigiMwoan 28d ago
Draw was pretty good in world with velkhana g set, but I don't think there is a similair set in wilds so at that point why bother with draw skills at all
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u/XFalzar Long Sword Pleb 28d ago
the difference with frost craft is that it still allows you to boost multiple hits, so it would for example, boost your TCS damage by a good 20%, which is a lot. The crit draw on that set was just a really nice bonus.
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u/LuigiMwoan 28d ago
That's also a very good point. And you could negate frostcraft loss by hitting the ground, so you could get the full frostcraft bonus on the TCS (although without the draw bonus).
All in all a draw build in worlds was great fun and plenty effective and I think its because you had multiple stacking bonuses, and you were actually able to use different playstyles with the same build while keeping reasonable effectiveness.
Petition to bring back velk g set?
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u/FlareGlutox Using more upswings than charges! 28d ago
I've used Crit Draw GS builds all the way through the end game of World and Rise, so I'd still like it to be supported in future games.
In fact, I'm glad they reversed the Rise nerf for Wilds.
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u/atfricks 28d ago
The Babel lance pisses me off so much, because unlike the others, it doesn't have the excuse of "weapons from this monster have draw skills."
They intentionally picked a blatantly useless skill to put on it.
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u/Nanergy 28d ago
Even some monster weapons don't have that excuse. Nerscylla weapons all have generally decent skills like guard, offensive guard, focus, etc. And then the Gunlance has fuckin Crit Draw and Crit Status. Two 100% useless skills for that weapon type, despite the monster generally providing several skills that are all great for gunlance. They just fucked it for some reason.
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u/Right-Aspect2945 28d ago
I think weapon skills, while neat in theory, doesn't work overall. The problem is that weapons already have so many variables such as damage, affinity, sharpness, element type, phial type, etc. that now finding a weapon that has all the things you want *and* has the right weapon skills on it is basically impossible.
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u/SaturnSeptem 28d ago
That's the point. They want you to make choose between good stats, slots and skills.
I'm not sure how I feel about this systems overall (just have 60 hours), for now as another user already said I just look at the stats and the skill is either a bonus or a meh whatever.
Been using only GS tho, I feel it doesn't have Lance or DBs problem.
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u/Right-Aspect2945 28d ago
And honestly it's probably fine for GS, Hammer, and other "simpler" weapons. But when you get into Switch Axe, Charge Blade, Gun Lance, or Hunting Horn where they've got a bunch of other factors on top of damage, affinity, and sharpness, it gets harder to find a weapon that hits enough sweet spots. With Greatsword you can go "Ah, here's the weapon I want and it does fire damage like I need. Ah, but the skills suck. But here's another fire greatsword that has great skills, affinity sucks on it but I can work around that" With HH it's finding a HH with fire and the buffs you want *and* has good skills on it, which is harder to do by virtue of variables.
At least until I get deeper in the game (only around 50 hours myself) where I can deco myself out of the problem I'm forced to choose between weapons I'm meh on but have the skills I want for my build or the weapons I do want that have garbage skills that I'll never use and struggle more with hunting because of it.
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u/progrocksterone the interplay of sax and violence 28d ago edited 28d ago
Bowgun girlies can you explain why my Rey Dau LBG has Slugger on it
Edit: Thank you bowgun girlies I had somehow missed entirely that the thing can load sticky ammo
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u/MagiLagi 28d ago
By endgame in World Sticky HBG was miles better at ko than hammers and it will probably be the case in wilds two,
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u/HalcyonHorizons 28d ago
The recoil is ass and the damage is worse than normal / pierce, at least at this point.
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u/erickdredd 28d ago
Firing from your chocobo negates a lot of the recoil issues, I've noticed.
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u/Nxhko biiiiiig doots 28d ago
I love that you call it a chocobo lol
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u/Jeanschyso1 28d ago
Story time.. I used to have a Vespa sprint 50. I called it my Chocobo.
Now, my Seikret is called Vespa Sprint 50. We have gone full circle.
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u/Shandod 28d ago
Saw a YouTube video showing that just blasting from your mount is basically same dps as shooting on foot because it reduces recoil and reload animations, and is far safer for movement.
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u/erickdredd 28d ago
The only downside is you lose the shield, which is mitigated by the insane mobility you gain. It's not the worst trade-off.
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u/Every-Intern5554 28d ago
Not with the stupefying of bowguns it won't. Recoil, reload speed, deviation... All dust in the wind. Takes 2 years to reload a sticky mag, it's good for one stun a hunt
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u/Every_Preference_212 28d ago
WE DONT SHEATH OUR WEAPON! bro I doubt there's even one lance main on the dev team.
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u/Apprehensive-Put883 28d ago
Weapon skills are stupid. Like legit so many weapons have a garbage skill on them? Why? Legit just should have slapped another decoration slot on them instead, ffs.
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u/Arendoor 28d ago
It's on some SnS and it's like brother, I don't sheath this weapon till the monster leaves the zone.
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u/CynthiaStarcrossed 28d ago
It goes so much further than this. Guard and Guard up are both weapon skills despite being entirely defensive so now you either build for tankiness and safety or you build for damage and there is no way to mix it like in previous games.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Newt190 28d ago
Yup, absolutely hate this. I also think it's dumb that they reduced the Guard tax from 5 to 3, only to give Guard Up 2 more skills. 🤦♂️
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u/UltimateCarl https://i.imgur.com/pvYdbv8.gif 27d ago
I've never understood the massive investment Guard and Guard Up (and if you're going for those you're almost certainly going for Offensive Guard as well) require. It's not like any block-heavy weapon has ever been particularly OP, least of all because of its guarding capabilities. Meanwhile, multiple weapons get counters that work even better than blocking for no investment at all.
It just feels like one of those weird vestigial things from early MH, where everything was a little slower and more drawn out, stamina loss from blocking was actually a potential problem, you were expected to get hit, and running out of potions/resources was a real possibility. Limiting the ways players have to minimize damage and risk makes sense in that context, but much less so now.
That said, in Wilds it really feels like Guard Up 1 and no Guard at all is perfectly serviceable for Lance since the Perfect Guard timing is so generous. Even without Perfect timing, I think the only thing in the entire game so far I've tried and failed to block was Jim da Hard's big ol' ice age attack. Jim's and Rey Dau's railguns don't even do that much chip with only GU1 and upgraded armor.
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u/CynthiaStarcrossed 27d ago
And Gore Magala that does around 50% of my hp in chip damage on some attacks just because he feels particularly spiteful AT ALL TIMES.
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u/Yeetus_001 Unga bunga me like discharge 27d ago
There's also no consistency on what is a weapon skill and what isn't. Like, attack and crit eye are both weapon skills despite applying to all weapons universally, but agitator gets to be an armour skill? Flayer? Burst?? Oh but guard and guard up oh yeah that's totally a weapon specific skill you should deffo have to choose between guard up and attack (who made these decisions???).
It feels like this system was made right before the game came out and they had almost no time to test it, rather than an integral design decision that was there from the moment they decided you could have 2 weapons.
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u/Yipeekayya Comically Massive Lance Thrusting MIGHT 28d ago
i dun understand givin lance the "punishing draw" skill when you shouldn't be sheathing always while playing the lance.
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u/th5virtuos0 28d ago
The funniest thing is that KANAME main Lance yet both Tokuda and Ryozo can’t be bothered to give them decent skills lmao
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u/DeeboDongus 28d ago
But how are you supposed to have fun without not having fun? -some game dev probably
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u/Elygium 28d ago
Does draw do anything on lances? Or does it only work on one specific move?
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u/Rav_Black Wiggler God 28d ago
No move unequips your weapon or anything like how it used to work with LS. For lance its an entirely useless skill as you almost never sheath your Lance since the animation is very slow and its just more effective to use the dash to close a distance
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u/No_Advice930 28d ago
you know they had to gut lala barina lance with that dogshit weapon skill cuz that shit carried me till endgame
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u/BoredWeazul 28d ago
does critical draw work with sneak attacks?
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u/lindechene 28d ago edited 28d ago
One might guess that could stack. Question is how much damage do sneak attacks do combined with draw attacks?
If that combo would allow players to significally shorten hunt times whenever a large monster looses aggro...
But maybe that works best on Small Monsters when farming materials?
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u/SaelemBlack 28d ago
Honestly. On top of it, why tf is guard up a 3-slot skill in this game? Just to screw over lance players?
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u/Zeldamaster736 28d ago
The whole game seems like a random mess of great ideas and complete failures on a design level.
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u/Mikadomea 28d ago
Same Problem with some SnS. Why would i need abcritical draw on my weapon that i can leave out and still can use my whole inventory. It makes no sense.
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u/SirPorthos Come back with your shield or on it 28d ago
Why does it feel like devs knew that adding relevant skills would make a lot of sense for the weapon switch mechanic and hence intentionally gimped this to relegate it to a gimmick?
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u/4ny3ody 28d ago
Every weapon type has some weapons with useless skills.
My guess is it was meant as a counterbalance much like some weapons just have lower than average raw, sharpness, affinity or elemental values.
Could it have been a different, near useless skill that at least doesn't feel as off-putting? Yes.
Did they always balance it properly? No, some weapons have cuts to other values despite useless skills.
Are these weapons unviable? No. They've done a good job of having each weapon branch be rather usable at minimal dps loss, unlike near every game before Sunbreak.
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u/jzillacon SnS, the ultimate all-in-one tool. 28d ago
But the weapons pictured above are already counter balanced by other factors anyway. Babel and Lala Barina don't have the best raw to begin with and have no additional element for damage, while the Dosha weapons are balanced out by low sharpness and negative affinity.
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u/Regular_Season4865 28d ago
I agree. I still find it funny that the skills they decided to include for every melee class are draw skills, even for weapons that only sheath like 3 times per hunt, haha.
Wish they could've put something a little better, especially since most weapons that have these skills don't have great stats (like the Babel and Dosha lances) but it is what it is.
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u/4ny3ody 28d ago
They would've been a prime candidate for those gimmicky skills people who didn't look into the math always overestimate.
Critical status for example matches the theme of some of the affected weapons and still provides near nothing but feels right. For non GS/LS Doshaguma something like negative crit would've been appropriate while doing basically as little as punishing draw. Well slightly more but still not really worth mentioning.→ More replies (3)
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u/azuraith4 28d ago
There's so many things I dislike about this game. This is a main one. Severely limits skill builds and diversity on MOST weapons.
Rise was infinitely better for build diversity and gameplay tbh.
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u/barriboy8 28d ago
I'm maining lance in this game, I'm loving it also.. Why.. Just why the fuck we have those
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u/kevihaa 28d ago
Folks are giving Capcom too little credit.
Once the decision was made to include skills on weapons, having completely useless skills on said weapons as a form of balance was inevitable.
Weapons can’t just have +damage skills because what would be the point, just make the weapon stronger.
Weapons, like armor, need to be stingy with the indirect damage skills as that’s how “good” weapons are differentiated from “bad” weapons.
Finally, quality of life skills also carry a bunch of indirect value, so they too need to be limited to the “better” weapons.
That just leaves situational / weapon inappropriate skills, which allows “bad” weapons to still have skills but clearly be included purely as a cosmetic option.
The fact that Capcom continues to double down on character vouchers and no layered at launch is the real issue here.
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u/Cress02 28d ago
Draw stuff seems like its only really good for GS and LS, and i was under the impression weapon skills included skills that were really good for the weapon, since alot of Hunting Horns have things like horn maestro and slugger.
I would have assumed lanced would get defensive skills, or artillery in the case of gunlace. Draw skills is a really weird decision here
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u/Proof_Macaron279 28d ago
I feel like Gunlance definitely got the better end of Weapon Skills. The Quematrice tree literally has built in Guard 3, and I believe the akrajan tree has built Artillery 2
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u/AhmCha I have no tail cuts, and I must B O N K 28d ago
Yeah the skill distribution in the weapons is something I genuinely think they should do a once-over on. IIRC there isn't a single Gunlance with Artillery baked into it, which is just wild (heh) to me.