r/politics • u/sweatycat New York • 20h ago

California to Negotiate Trade With Other Countries to Bypass Trump Tariffs

https://www.newsweek.com/california-newsom-trade-trump-tariffs-2055414
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u/pm_me_ur_ParusMajors North Carolina 19h ago

Considering how much agriculture and manufacturing actually come out of California, this would have a substantial impact on the rest of the US. The California gdp is as much as in the top 5 gdp's in the world.

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u/StoneCypher 19h ago

 this would have a substantial impact on the rest of the US. 

He wants to destroy the country, so

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u/JohnnySnark Florida 19h ago

Yep, destroy the country for Russia's benefit

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u/Virtual_Plantain_707 19h ago

Best investment they’ve ever made.

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u/ToughTalkingTurtle 19h ago

Is it true that he didn't place tariffs on Russia?

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u/Songshiquan0411 19h ago

Yes. His administration officials have tried the line of "we already sanction them, we don't really do any trade with Russia already". Okay I didn't know we did that much trade with Vanuatu but you still hit them with tariffs.

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u/bdone2012 18h ago

They put tariffs on the Heard and McDonald island. It’s near the South Pole and is just a bunch of penguins, no humans. I can’t believe I need to say this but putting tariffs on Russia makes more sense than putting them on a island full of penguins.

My guess is that the ChatGPT didn’t think about putting tariffs on Russia because of the sanctions and somehow it got confused with the Heard and McDonalds island.

There’s a strong theory that the whole thing was done using chatGPT because this is the exact plan you get when you ask how to implement tariffs from the us to other countries.

https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/will-careless-stupidity-kill-the

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u/bewildered_dismay California 18h ago

Here's the official Heard Island Government account on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/heardislandgov.bsky.social

:)

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u/backupbitches 16h ago

Holy fuck are they ever killing it

*krilling it

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u/squakmix 18h ago

This is gold, thanks

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u/Constant-Funny1817 12h ago

I started rolling in hysteria just at flippers up.

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u/-Smaug-- Canada 17h ago

That is magnificent

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u/HauntedCemetery Minnesota 15h ago

Well that's delightful.

We take tariffs on our beautiful Heard Island very seriously. We will be consulting all mammals and flightless birds and will make an announcement in the near future detailing our response.

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u/Far_Recommendation82 17h ago

I followed lol

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u/theyca11m3dav3 16h ago

This is hilarious! A bit of mirth on a very serious topic. Reminds me of a joke: Why do comedians never tell jokes about penguins?

Because they don’t fly.

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u/doesamulletmakeaman 16h ago

Omg thank you for this

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u/ninja_kitten_ 16h ago

OMG. I love it. Immediately followed!!

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u/CompetitionExternal5 12h ago

Russians have hacked the Tariff signal chat and swapped Russia for Heard and McDobald island. The Russian hacker was under the name of Not Jeff Goldberg, so nobody suspected foul play.

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u/againwiththisbs 18h ago

My guess is that the ChatGPT didn’t think about putting tariffs on Russia because of the sanctions and somehow it got confused with the Heard and McDonalds island.

Or more simply they just took out the allied countries when making the list.

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u/TiredEsq 18h ago

It makes me sick to hear Russia referred to as an allied country but I guess we really are there.

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u/MangoCats 16h ago

Don't forget North Korea...

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u/976chip Washington 18h ago

When people were reading through the Signal text thread, there was a lot of speculation that Hegseth used ChatGPT to word his responses as well. It can be difficult to distinguish between something poorly written by AI and something poorly written by an idiot that's trying to sound competent though.

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u/well-of-wisdom 18h ago

Elon will be pissed when he hears that they used chatGPT over his xAI.

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u/dw82 18h ago

And Iran is sanctioned and got new tariffs.

They're so full of bs.

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u/Junior_Chard9981 16h ago edited 15h ago

This is the exact response needed for every Conservative who attempts to use the "but sanctions" line.

It is easier for them to continue looking for excuses to rationalize why Russia was not also heavily tarrifed versus facing the reality that is a US president who is either sympathetic towards or compromised by the Russians, if not both.

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u/Vanished_Elephant 15h ago

Trump and Russian oligarchs, name a better duo!

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u/HauntedCemetery Minnesota 15h ago

So is Syria.

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u/654456 18h ago

They are going to remove sanctions in a few weeks anyway

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u/HighVulgarian 18h ago

They’ve already started removing sanctions

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u/toru_okada_4ever 18h ago

But, what about all the new factories that are being built as a result of the tariffs??

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u/HighVulgarian 18h ago

I’m assuming /s here.

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u/othelloinc 18h ago

His administration officials have tried the line of "we already sanction them, we don't really do any trade with Russia already".

...and yet they put tariffs on Iran.

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u/doubtfurious Texas 18h ago

He put a 50% tariff on Lesotho, and (according to his Joint Address to Congress) nobody has ever heard of them.

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u/gmplt Ohio 18h ago

That excuse is pure bullshit. Iran and Libya are also sanctioned, but they got hit with tariffs.

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u/winter7 New York 18h ago

We don't trade with penguins either and yet.

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u/PowerResponsibility 19h ago

This is literally it. He's just doing what Putin is telling him to do. The point is to destroy the United States, all of it.

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u/JohnnySnark Florida 19h ago

Well, all of the Americas too. Russia needs a weaker Canada and Mexico for their ultimate goals

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u/Moon_whisper 18h ago

Canada and Mexico aren't weaker though. Everybody is just making new partners, better and stronger alliances and USA is going to be left on the sidelines like an aged hooker.

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u/Clerence69 17h ago

"Like an aged hooker", beautifully put

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u/Moon_whisper 17h ago

She sold herself so often, she is pretty cheap and desperate now. And the world isn't going to want her. Other countries sell oranges, bananas, grapes, etc. California isn't needed. World is going electric. Other countries can sell meat, don't need Texas. Bonus, growth hormone free meat.

Gambling? Dubai is pretty spectacular. For a lot of the world, it is cheaper to travel to. Technology? Japan, China, South Korea are kicking butt in those areas.

USA isn't needed. And honestly, if Trump government was gone tomorrow, USA is still an aged hooker. Just way to insane and unstable to trust. The American people wanted this government, want the death of democracy, the death of freedom, the death of liberty, the stripping of human rights. The Natzis and fascists are out in droves.

The people who swore to protect liberty & freedom for all, democracy and the costitution have done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in the face of fascism and the blatent gutting of all the ideologies USA pretends to stand for.

The American people cannot be trusted. Will not be trusted again anytime soon.

There is literally nothing the USA can offer the world that will be trusted or even wanted. For all intents and purposes, USA is done, finish, and not a super power.

A government for the people, by the people...not a good reflection on the type of people there. While the world recognizes not all people in the USA are like that, there is enough like that to make it happen.

Most of the world doesn't want, or need, to do business with people that low on morals or so devoid of humanity.

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u/joshdoereddit 17h ago

Aged hooker with syphilis. Hence, the insanity.

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u/JohnnySnark Florida 17h ago

Canada and Mexico having to scramble with the world economy makes them weaker right now.

The whole west is weaker now because of trump's moves. Yes, other countries will find other new allies and drop the US but that doesn't stop the trump admin selectively attacking these former allies with not just more economic wars via sanctions but also military actions.

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u/Moon_whisper 17h ago

Dude, Europe is already preparing for war. Most countries are back to everybody doing military service. Germany auto makers are already making military vehicles.

China can supply the world on military good while old factories are being upgraded. It will not take as long as you might think to get up to par.

The world has done it multiple times. They are well aware and not biting their nails in fear at the loss of the traitors.

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u/retze44 18h ago

Make it cheap so oligarchs can get the fuck out of russia and buy all the assets cheap. Better learn russian :)

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u/77NorthCambridge 18h ago

All they have to do is pay Trump $5 million to become American citizens, sanctions no longer apply, and they can freely travel to the US.

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u/PenaltyDesperate3706 18h ago

Next scene is trump picking up an additional fight with the EU re unfreezing Russian oligarchs’ assets for a 25% commission

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u/77NorthCambridge 18h ago

You mean like putting "tariffs" on Canada to justify buying Russian potash?

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u/PenaltyDesperate3706 18h ago

Nope. I mean making the EU banking institutions give back whatever they have on frozen Russian assets so the oligarchs can bring those funds to “invest” in the US.

If I were Canada, I would set an export tax on sales of Canadian potash to the US “because all Canadians are in this together”

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u/suckyousideways 17h ago

Putin figured it out: you don't HAVE to bomb a country or send war planes etc., and wreck everything, and risk retaliation... You can put the right stooge in power and he'll just hand it over, almost fully intact.

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u/DrZaious 18h ago

Read the grievances listed in the Declaration of Independence, it's like Putin told Trump to do those things. Which is probably why Trump wanted the DOI on display in the oval.

Putin openly thinks that democracy is a sham. If you know anything about Putin, he would get off on destroying America using the same methods which inspired it's sovereignty.

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u/Iggyhopper 19h ago

I mean, he would destroy the part of the country that already sucks, like Kansas. California is proving this point, and other states will join in.

We'll keep all the blue states (which are gdp positive), y'all can deal with whatever Russia offers you lol.

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u/DysphoricNeet 16h ago

I’m a trans woman in Kansas and I’m going to continue my survival plan of never leaving my fucking house

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u/Jemerius_Jacoby 19h ago

It’s Krasnov being activated. He’s going to turn the US into the USSR. Maybe we’ll get some free healthcare out of it.

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u/JohnnySnark Florida 19h ago

Free Healthcare in the gulags or front line in Canada fighting against the US.

Those may be the options

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u/Gold-Perspective-699 Pennsylvania 19h ago

We are the United States of Russia already.

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u/Successful_Dig_2264 18h ago

Devided States of Russia

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u/aquanda 18h ago

I think it's primarily for billionaires benefit, but obviously a weak U.S. helps Russia as well. When we go full recession/depression, the tech oligarchs will be able to buy everything up for pennies.

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u/InsuranceToTheRescue I voted 19h ago

And so Elon et al. can turn us into a feudal state.

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u/justin251 18h ago

Let's be honest. He's dumb enough that Putin probably convinced him it's for the best for the US.

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u/Tiny-Plum2713 19h ago

100% for his own as well. He's always been a con man.

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u/Winowill Washington 18h ago

You think he wants to, or is too stupid to realize that is what he is doing? Like, I don't think he is trying to benefit the average American. But I don't know that he actually realizes he is a puppet either. My random thoughts circle back to this whenever he does something that seems so obviously bad

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u/NW_Oregon 17h ago

glad people are finally catching on, this is the MAIN goal. anything else is just peripheral.

His marching orders come straight from Putin

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u/Moist_When_It_Counts New York 17h ago

Not just Russia, the christofascists are biding their time to take over a collapsed USA

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u/gordonbombae2 19h ago

This is what people seem to not understand. This is what he wants. Russia won the Cold War.

The rest of the world will continue and live on. America is fucked.

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u/tymtt 18h ago

I think this is the case, but he has a bunch of competing interests within his group. There's the technocrats like Peter Thiel that want a complete societal collapse, the investors that just want extreme market volatility they can profit from, and countries like Russia who want to diminish the influence the US has on the world. Trump is taking money from all of them, and I'm sure he doesn't even know his endgame

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u/Geraltpoonslayer 18h ago

Suddenly the Civil War movie with Texas and California on the same side would make alot more sense if Texas also would be hit economically

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u/irokain75 11h ago

People really aren't fucking getting it at all. It isn't about "buying the dip." It isn't about oligarchs crashing the economy to buy property on the cheap. It isn't about the ruling class. It isn't about money at least not anymore because money already got the fascists into power. Now it is about burning it all the fuck down. The entire US economy. I think over the past month 7 trillion in wealth no longer exists in the stock market beacuse of actions the Trump administration was ordered to take by the Heritage Foundation.

You all remember Heritage Foundation right? Oh right you don't because you all have spent the entire past 2 god damn months being distracted by Musk and Trump. By fucking oligarchs and techbros. By endlessly bitching about Bernie got robbed and how the DNC is corrupt and how Democrats who are the minority party that this country fucking voted out and is now all of a sudden wanting to have power again.

We need to stop worrying about money. Money is absolutely fucked at this point. There is no fixing what has been done until we get the fucking fascists out. The AOC and Bernie "fight oligarchy" tour has been nothing but a far left distraction to keep us angry over fucking money and scared about losing our jobs and our healthcare so we don't fucking fight back against fascism Think long and hard on why they named oligarchy as the primary cause to fight. And look at history at when oligarchy became a thing. Oligarchs only came into being after the destruction of the USSR. Oligarchs in the US are NOT who we need to be fighting because when they turn up the US will already be gone. It is the fucking fascists in the god damn white house. It is the fucking fascists in the god damn congress. it is the fucking fascists in SCOTUS.

There is no class war if we don't have our human and civil rights and THAT is what we need to be fighting for right now.

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u/ciel_lanila I voted 19h ago edited 17h ago

Just looked the raw GDP numbers in case anyone is curious. .

  • US with CA: $30.338 trillion
  • European Union (as a whole): $20.29 trillion
  • China: $19.535 trillion
  • Germany: $4.922 t
  • Japan: $4.390 t
  • India: $4.270 t
  • California: $4.1 t
  • UK: $3.731 t
  • Skipping a few
  • Russia: $2.197 t

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u/SweetAlyssumm 19h ago

We also have a bunch of military bases. We could almost actually do this.

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u/seaQueue 19h ago

We'd probably want to bring OR and WA along for the ride

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u/mr_oof 19h ago

Chuckles in Cascadia

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u/_illogical_ 19h ago

Shout-out to /r/cascadia

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u/mr_oof 18h ago

LA, Portland, Seattle and Vancouver- North America’s quirky, slightly sketchy queer uncles.

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u/_illogical_ 18h ago

You seem to have forgotten San Francisco

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u/mr_oof 18h ago

I said ‘slightly’ sketchy-queer. SF counts as ‘utterly.’

Compared to Victoria, Eugene and Sacramento, who fall high on the ‘quaint-nerdy’ index.

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u/Cosmosass 18h ago

Vancouver Island here. We are like the sketchy Vancouver Uncle's weird nephew. We make a good addition to Cascadia I promise

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u/starkeffect 17h ago

Quirkly, slightly sketchy queer uncles with great taste in music and craft beer.

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u/SpaceForceAwakens 18h ago

I’m down for it. We already have a dope flag.

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u/beamrider 18h ago

That would include joining up with British Columbia. Which is looking like a better and better deal each day.

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u/HiiiTriiibe 18h ago

I feel like it’s probably time we turn that chuckle into a guffaw

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u/Damn_Dog_Inappropes Washington 19h ago

As a native San Diegan living in Seattle, yes, please!

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u/cerealjunky 17h ago

Found Eddie Vedder's Reddit account!

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u/sdcanine99 14h ago

As a native Seattleite living in San Diego, glad we could change places, and also, yes, please!

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u/Pherllerp New Jersey 19h ago

You'd be getting a lot more than OR and WA. If California goes, the Northeast goes with you.

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u/ordinaryseawomn 18h ago

As long as we call whatever’s left over Gillead….and we’re all on the correct side of the fence!

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u/EggsceIlent 19h ago

As a wa resident I'm totally for this.

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u/jkman61494 Pennsylvania 18h ago

And you’d likely add Hawaii

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u/PennytheWiser215 19h ago

Please bring NY too

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u/beamrider 18h ago

From WA here: YES! PLEASE!

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u/diamondpredator 17h ago

If there is any state in the union that would be successful after seceding it would be CA. TX MAY be able to pull it off, but they're a lot more dependent on federal funds than CA is and they don't have the same amount of production we do.

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u/SweetAlyssumm 17h ago

Both have excellent Mexican food so we are covered there.

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u/ConfessSomeMeow 17h ago

Those military bases are not under the command of or loyal to the government of California. "We have a bunch of military bases" is a reason why we could not do this.

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u/carnutes787 16h ago

i can't believe this is always lost on so many people, you're exactly right. california is specifically in the least advantageous situation as far as actual secession, there is fully zero chance the pentagon would ever let those pacific naval bases be lost

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u/PhilbertNoyce 18h ago edited 18h ago

Much as I'd love to see them pull it off, it's not going to happen. Most of rural California would not go along with it. They could and would sabotage roads, power stations, gas lines, water supplies, etc. There is no way the governor and the CA national guard could even begin to bring a situation like that under control if the majority of people outside the big cities aren't onboard. You'd have an unmitigated disaster on your hands even if the feds just stepped back and said "Fine, go for it." Which they won't because they're actively hostile.

If you don't have enough cynicism in your life yet, check out the "It Could Happen Here" podcast by Robert Evans. It's not enjoyable but it's something more people definitely should have been listening to.

edit: Fixed formatting and mobile mistakes

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u/elcapitan520 18h ago

Shout out to It Could Happen Here and Robert Evans 

The original series is a little harder to find now that they have a daily news show. But it's from 2019 and is a 10 episode exploration of what a US civil war would look like from the perspective of a conflict journalist who studies extremist groups.

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u/PhilbertNoyce 18h ago

I finally got around to listening to it last fall before the election. I went from feeling like "Yeah, we're probably really fucked no matter what happens in the next few years" to "Jesus Christ, we are so completely and irretrievably fucked." Then the election results came in and I had to move all my timelines up by about 10 years.

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u/Electrifying2017 California 17h ago

Just give it time. Rural California is currently buckling from all the fed cuts and tariffs. 

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u/staxnet California 19h ago

And Lawrence Livermore Lab, Jet Propulsion Lab, ports, on and off-shore oil reserves, oil refineries, and natural obstacles (Sierra Nevada/Mojave Desert)

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u/tawwkz 17h ago

Throwing away 200 trillion in trade in order to nurture 2 trillion in trade with Russia.

Big brain idea. The bigliest.

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u/Crappler319 District Of Columbia 19h ago

Incidentally, the Northeast Megalopolis, the other large contiguous strip of majority Democratic rule, has a GDP of 5.3 trillion.

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u/justbrowse2018 Kentucky 19h ago

China sure moved up in 20 years

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u/Sterling239 18h ago

As someone from the UK I don't know  how my tiny country does better than the largest country on the planet 

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u/Cisco-NintendoSwitch 19h ago

Right, California could secede and collapse all the red states.

Either way we’re heading to something.

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u/TehMephs 19h ago

Take us with you!

Signed, Colorado

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u/Sudden-Investment 19h ago

In the non realistic fever dream of States seceding I always felt Colorado would get shafted since it struck in the middle of the US.

  • California, Oregon, Washington are fine since they have the Pacific Ocean.
  • Minnesota, Michigan, maybe Wisconsin all share a border with Canada to the North.
  • New York and many of the North East States either border Canada or the Atlantic Ocean.
  • Colorado borders all Deep Red States and New Mexico.

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u/AllRushMixTapes 18h ago

Colorado would be invaded because of the watershed. No way does the U.S. let us leave without a fight.

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u/headbangershappyhour 15h ago

In that case, CA would launch a counterattack into Southern NV/Northern AZ to capture the entire Hoover and Glen Canyon Dam infrastructure and all of the associated water distribution networks. That water is too important for Los Angeles and to bribe the central valley farmers to not revolt.

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u/TheBigWil 15h ago

Basically New Vegas, but without the cool stuff

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u/KasseanaTheGreat Iowa 15h ago

Maybe if Musk decides to double down on insisting it was actually a "Roman" salute it might literally just be New Vegas

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u/Dorgamund 15h ago

It would have to go either way. If CO makes threats to the states downstream of the river, it could very likely drag those other states along.

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u/b34tn1k 18h ago

Three of those red states heavily rely on the Colorado River, maybe we turn off the faucet. I know it's not realistic but still

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u/ragnarokxg 18h ago

Colorado and New Mexico cutting off the water to the Colorado and Rio Grande rivers would hurt Arizona and Texas so bad.

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u/starmartyr Colorado 15h ago

Nevada as well. Las Vegas would be uninhabitable within weeks.

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u/ragnarokxg 18h ago

New Mexico and Colorado could help California annex Arizona.

Remember New Mexico has the bombs.

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u/yuriaoflondor 16h ago edited 16h ago

Worth pointing out that Wisconsin voted for Trump in 2024. Though it’s long been a swing state. And as a cheesehead myself… please for the love of god get me off Trump’s Wild Ride.

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u/Freshness518 16h ago

I feel like it wouldn't take much to convince Nevada to go as well. I bet Vegas would just follow the money. And if all the money just left, they would follow. A bunch of dirt poor desert ranchers in the north aren't going to hold much sway against the power and influence of billions of entertainment dollars once the direction of Vegas is different than theirs.

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u/Drak_is_Right 15h ago

Its hard to undersell just how big of a deal Great Lakes shipping (combined with the Mississippi-Ohio-Missouri) has been for the US. You have a 600 ft. vessels nearly a thousand miles from the sea.

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u/ankhes 13h ago

I think a lot of people don’t truly understand just how massive the Great Lakes are (especially Superior and Michigan) until they see them in person. As someone who was born and raised near the Pacific and now lives less than an hour from Lake Michigan, the latter behaves shockingly similar to the former.

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u/SharpCookie232 19h ago

Same. Here in Massachusetts.

The blue states should secede. On our own or in some kind of partnership with Canada (United States of Canadia?). The red states are an anchor around our neck. We need to cut them loose.

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u/whoibehmmm 19h ago

Couldn't agree more. They've been holding us back for decades.

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u/NecroCannon 16h ago

Even before all of this I decided to move from Mississippi because there’s genuinely no future here, the state refuses to progress to grow and will take two steps back just to make sure it stays that way.

Meanwhile I look at Illinois, where I’m going to, and the Gov is on Trump’s ass and also doing trade negotiations behind Trump’s back around tariffs

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u/whoibehmmm 15h ago

Good on you for getting out! My personal feelings about Newsom and Pritzker aside, all blue state govs should be following their lead.

And I know lots of leftists will argue "we should be moving TO red states to flip them" but fuck that. Their majority vote that way because they want to stay that way. After this circus of an election I am done trying to make them see the light. If you want to live in a place that actively tries to move forward then you're just going to have to pick up and move to those places.

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u/TehMephs 19h ago

+2 from this household

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u/Senior-Albatross New Mexico 18h ago

We can then just invade, liberate the red states, and make them territories without actual voting power. So we'll have a US again but with an updated constitution and better voters.

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u/whoibehmmm 17h ago

Liberate them? They vote for the policies that keep them in the stone age, it's what they want. They should just form their own dream coalition where they have God but no education, healthcare and technology and their blue voters can come to our side.

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u/donkeyrocket 17h ago

As someone who lives in a strong blue spot within a deep red state, I depressingly get the sentiment but keep in mind that there are people everywhere that voted for this while others are caught within states with rural red rule.

The Democrat stronghold of Massachusetts that had the strongest Harris vote still saw 36% voting for Trump.

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u/whoibehmmm 16h ago

Oh, I know, and I feel you. Every single state no matter how "red" or "blue" can't be distilled down to just that. In a world where blue states could actually form their own government, there would likely be a lot of blue voters trapped in red states because moving isn't that easy in reality. And vice versa.

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u/MissRepresent 18h ago

They keep us poor in red states, so we can't afford to move..wish I could leave

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u/espressocycle 18h ago

I think New England and California could both secede while maintaining state lines. The rest of the country is too divided.

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u/AiBestGirl95 17h ago

Oregon and Washington could form Cascadia

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u/tamman2000 Maine 17h ago

Secession would be really difficult, with how intertwined the states are, and federal facilities being spread out all over, etc...

I would love to see a coalition of blue states form. The coalition could create agencies independent of the federal government to backfill all the functions that Trump is taking away.

But if states do start to leave. I really hope my blue tinted, but not solid blue state joins

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u/Duna_The_Lionboy 19h ago

They need to lift themselves up by their own bootstraps for once.

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u/1ndiana_Pwns 17h ago

Blue states seceding? The United States undergoing balkanization?

I'm not against this, shockingly

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u/MasterChildhood437 18h ago

Unfortunately the vast amount of space between California and the eastern blue states makes it challenging to become a singular entity. Likely New England either becomes its own thing or partners with New York and its sphere of influence.

I see this as roughly being the way things go in the next decade, since the differences between ideologies are irreconciliable. Five or six different nations resulting in the end, with California, New York, Texas, and Florida being the major territories.

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u/Inside-Palpitation25 17h ago

I just said yesterday, that If a democrat ever wins again, I want them to say that the Blue states are Tired of giving the red states money, that the red states will only get back in Fed money, what they PAY!

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u/SharpCookie232 17h ago

Right?? We have proportional representation, why not proportional taxation and allotments?

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u/i_love_pencils 19h ago

United States of Canadia?

How aboot no?

If you want in, you’re becoming provinces…

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u/Zjarrr 18h ago edited 18h ago

This is why I think an independent nation (or a few nations) that closely ally themselves to Canada is the way to go. As a Minnesotan I have always felt closer to Canadians then I have with most of my countrymen, but I definitely understand that the feeling isn't mutual after threatening to annex you and then placing tariffs on you for no reason

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u/Im_Not_Important 19h ago

The provence of New England does have a ring to it

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u/DOG_DICK__ 18h ago

I guess France will provide a Provence if we're committed to that spelling.

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u/NotASalamanderBoi I voted 19h ago

Fine by me.

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u/ThePhoenixus 18h ago

It's nice in theory but I have a bridge to sell you if you think Trump MAGA would let go peacefully.

Not to mention that theres no such thing as a pure red or blue state. Even the most blue states have about 30-40% of people who voted Republican, and the most red states have 30-40% people who vote Democrat.

In terms of numbers, there's more Republicans in states like New York and California than there are the total population of states like Alabama and Oklahoma. And vice versa theres more democrats in Florida and Texas than there are the total people in states like Maine and Massachusetts.

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u/SharpCookie232 17h ago

It might be an India / Pakistan type of situation, which would be unpleasant, but that's better than the alternative. If it does come to civil war, we already know how that ends and the last time we didn't have the west coast. It would be quick work.

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u/JeanLucPicardAND 16h ago

It's nice in theory but I have a bridge to sell you if you think Trump MAGA would let go peacefully.

Don't act like that's purely a MAGA thing. The secession question was resolved back in 1865. No one gets to leave.

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u/theapeboy 14h ago

The East Coast and West Coast secede in partnership. PINCER MOVE.

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u/nucking_futs_001 19h ago

Let's all be Canada!

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u/b34tn1k 18h ago

Every time those "fixed it" maps come out where it draws US states as part of Canada they always leave out CO and NM but include a couple of trump voting states. Due to that I've felt we should strike out on our own. We could control the flow of the Colorado River as leverage.

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u/whoibehmmm 19h ago

As a fellow Colorado resident, all I can think about is how we can find a way to link up to these other blue states. Also, I wish that our state government had the balls that CA does. If anything, I will pack my ass up and move back to the West Coast.

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u/echosrevenge 19h ago

Oooh, finally a non-American country where I'll qualify for Citizenship By Descent!

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u/entredeuxeaux 19h ago

Be careful, all. For some reason that is unknown to many, this is what they want. But why

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u/Allaplgy 18h ago

Because they want the US to break up into technofascist fiefdoms with an army of christofascists doing their bidding outside the city-states, and an absolute monarch at the helm.

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u/HauntedCemetery Minnesota 15h ago

It's literally just Atlas Shrugged where CEOs are monarchs

Fun fact, the only reason Ayn Rand didn't die homeless in the street was Social Security, which she had spent decades demonizing and trying to destroy. But she of course had no hesitation about taking it herself.

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u/Kup123 19h ago

Because everyone left leaning who is capable of it will move there. They would basically get what they consider the trash to take it's self out for free.

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u/SerRikari 19h ago

Explain

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u/ForgettableUsername America 19h ago

The US breaking up into warring factions is the biggest win Russia could have hoped for.

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u/hookyboysb 19h ago

It's a bigger win for China. They basically control the world economy once Trump is done messing with it. Russia won't truly be powerful until the EU collapses, which Trump is accidentally strengthening.

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u/mitkase 18h ago

And really, the odds of Russia being able to turn any of this into a big win is not very likely, at least to my eyes. Russia is overplaying its hand, Trump is eating paste, and China is sipping oolong in the background waiting for the Lil Tyrants to tire themselves out.

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u/VonSchplintah 18h ago

It always gets worse for the Russian people.

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u/RedditTrespasser 18h ago edited 18h ago

Say what you want about China, but that is one stable fucking country. The current PRoC has been getting nothing but stronger since the end of WW2, and China as a culture has existed in some form since before the time of Rome.

Despite what Sinophobics would want you to believe, China will be around long after the US has crumbled to dust, and may well outlive any European states.

Eastern philosophy values social harmony, collectivism and reverence towards the traditions and values of past generations. Western philosophy prizes individualism, competition, and dominating your environment. Guess which one is more prone to sparking conflict and hoarding of resources?

I’ll give you a hint- China actually punishes- severely- billionaires when they commit crimes.

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u/Tiruin 18h ago

Plenty of issues especially with housing and birth rates, Great Firewall goes both ways, you only think it's this stable monolith because you never hear otherwise.

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u/SerRikari 19h ago

Well… whatever your username was again… that’s a fair point.

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u/ArkitekZero 19h ago

Yeah any time I see this suggested I don't see anyone else asking what happens to the nukes and supercarriers. You aren't just gonna get a proportional amount of them handed over

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u/espressocycle 18h ago

California has more military installations assigned nuclear-warfare responsibilities than any other state and ranks fourth in the number of nuclear warheads stockpiled.

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u/Daxx22 Canada 19h ago

As relatively careful Civil War was to not be to politically specific, having California be one of the succeeding states is pretty realistic/required logistically.

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u/BirdOfHermess Europe 18h ago

I remember when people were slamming that specific movie for being "completely unrealistic" and "a president would never get a 3rd term IRL". Good times

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u/MVRKHNTR 18h ago

If I remember right, a lot of the worldbuilding from that was almost directly lifted from parts of Robert Evans' After the Revolution and as someone from a farming town who's studied and reported on actual civil wars, he had a pretty solid explanation for why California would ally with Texas.  

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u/F3z345W6AY4FGowrGcHt 19h ago

As a Canadian, I officially invite California to join us. 🇨🇦

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u/Fredrall 18h ago

You want to open the constitution? The last time it went so well...

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u/raphtze 18h ago

visited BC last year and LOVE IT. want to visit again this year :) we are making plans to visit victoria :P

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u/FaceDeer 18h ago

Absolutely not. California's population is roughly equal to Canada's and is culturally quite dissimilar to us, it would destroy Canada.

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u/FlallenGaming 18h ago

Yeah, can't understand why Canadians would want California. We're not the same. Let California have it's own country if it wants. 

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u/Strict_Somewhere_148 18h ago

Come over to the dark side we have butter cookies in our sewing tins.

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u/MadManMax55 18h ago

It would also collapse California.

I know everyone likes to point out their high GDP, but a huge amount of that comes from handling Pacific shipping for the rest of the US. Without a very generous trade agreement between California and the new US they'd lose a massive part of their economy. And that's just trade goods passing through California. Not being able to freely sell their domestically produced goods and services to the rest of the US could be catastrophic.

Maybe over time they'd stabilize (assuming the US doesn't invade them). But even best case scenario they'd end up with a GDP closer to Mexico or Canada.

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u/angrydeuce 18h ago

Who would have thought Civil War was a documentary

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u/ivegotaqueso 19h ago

I want my state (CA) to withhold federal tax dollars from the federal government til we get what we want.

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u/gmen6981 I voted 18h ago

As good as that sounds, there is no mechanism to do it. Employers collect Federal taxes and send them to the Fed. They don't go through the state. Every employer in the state ( many foreign based or not based in Cali) would have to agree to break Federal law and withhold them.

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u/Hephaistos_Invictus 19h ago

as much as the top 5 gdp's in the world

Wtf... I did not expect this to be true. That's mind boggling

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u/merikariu Texas 18h ago edited 6h ago

Yeah, ppl in Texas have bumper stickers that say "Don't California My Texas." But the CA's economy is much stronger, has better healthcare and labor protections, and weed is legal!

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u/DOG_DICK__ 18h ago

Shitload of people, the center of west coast shipping, agriculture, tech, hollywood. I mean the list goes on. The only reason I didn't move to California is the high cost of living.

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u/morethanjustanalien 17h ago

If people in red states could read, this would greatly change their opinions on California politics.

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u/qtx extra butter 18h ago

I mean is it? Americans always like to compare their states to countries. So this is what it looks like it it were actually true.

Each state is basically a country. Some have good economies, some bad.

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u/JinFuu 18h ago

GDP Wise for our top 5 states

California = India

Texas = Italy

New York = Brazil

Florida = Mexico

Illinois = Saudi Arabia

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u/Emotional_Money3435 19h ago

He doesnt care, havent u noticed?

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u/West_Side_Joe 19h ago

He cares. It's tea in the harbor. And California can do it: they have ports, and a road into Mexico and a huge GDP.

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u/Only-Inspector-3782 17h ago

He talks about a third term and is ruling like elections don't matter.

What are Americans going to do when Democrats somehow fail to gain any ground in 2 years?

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u/Uilamin 19h ago

The California gdp is as much as in the top 5 gdp's in the world.

While true (and California is ~11.6% of the USA), it only represents about 13.5% of the US GDP (4.1T of 30.35T). So while the State does contribute more than its 'fair share', it is only ~15% more. The real reason why California is so significant, is just the massive population there.

Interestingly, Texas is the opposite (and more extreme), ~9.2% of the population but only 6.7% of the GDP. On a per capita basis, Texas noticeably brings down the US GDP.

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u/flashlightgiggles 19h ago

trump thinks tariffs on products from California would be great...cause he thinks the libs in California will pay for the tariffs.

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u/theonewhoknocksforu 18h ago

He could put all the tariffs he wants on CA, but CA could negotiate its own trade agreement with other countries. There can’t be much that we need from other states that couldn’t be purchased from other countries. I’m liking this more and more.

Oh, and btw red states… the price for smartphones, computers, servers, networking equipment, and software are going up a lot.

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u/gmen6981 I voted 19h ago

Yep. California is the world's 5th largest economy and is the #1 state in both agriculture, manufacturing android tech.

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u/memphisjones 19h ago

Oh great….a civil war. Putin likey

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u/Oceanbreeze871 I voted 19h ago

And we control the majority of the west coast

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u/IHaveNoEgrets California 18h ago

50% of the nation's fruit and nuts. A wide variety of produce that's only grown here. The largest dairy producer in the nation.

If he comes for us, he's biting off way more than he can chew.

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u/Faxon 18h ago

Yea idk if Trump realizes it but California has more negotiating power than Canada, and a sizeable portion of the state is ready to fight him. Newsom is a shitheel but he also loves corporations and the California wealthy who keep him in office with the help of their donations, and these tariffs are bad for all of them too. He will react and he has the power to back it up.

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u/1minimalist 17h ago

1 in 8 Americans in Californian to put their massive population into context. They control most of the Pacific coast. There is no reason for them not to do this.

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